• Registered: 2008-10-27
  • Posts: 176

Topic: Fender or Marshall?

Hi guys!
Here's the "problem": I have the opportunity to buy a 1968 Fender Bassman head and a Marshall 30th Anniversary combo, the blue 100W one. Which one do I choose, since I can't try them (I'll have one of them shipped).
The thing is that I play blues/rock and I'm constantly playing tunes ala SRV, Mayer, Kenny Wayne Shepherd with my strat, and the next minute I'm pushing that Les Paul hard to Joe's You Upset me Baby and Walk in my Shadows covers, along with Gary Moore's My Baby or All Your Love...
I know the two different sounds are different, but I have to choose just one, I can't afford both. SO what would you do if you were me?
Of course if you say "neither one nor the other" just tell me what to get...
Thanks.
Fred.
BTW, I'm seeing Joe in 8 days in Toulouse, France, I just can't wait to get my **** kicked...

  • From: Pittsburgh
  • Registered: 2008-05-22
  • Posts: 261

Re: Fender or Marshall?

Twist...welcome to the community.
There's guys on here like Budda or Govtmule that are more up on this I am.  Even though I play rock with my touring band I also do jazz and blues when I'm hanging out locally. My Fuchs covers all these well although I'n still searching for a Dist pedal to put in the lead channel to give it that really extra umpf...think EJ's solo in at the end of Desert Rose.

The Fender or the Marshall?  I know a little about both but unfortunately not a bassman or the Marshall 30th Anniversay combo,  If it were a Fender Super Reverb I'd say go for that in a heartbeat.  It has fantastic clean sounds and handles pedals very well.

What kind of out board gear are you using?  What pedals/effects? The Bassman is a single channel amp that's pretty clean.  You'll have to rely soley on pedals for any OD/Dist tones.  I don't even think the bassman has verb on it.

The Marshall is a 3 channel amp and from Marshall's website:

Summary of 30th Anniversary Features

Original models 6100 (head) and 6101 (combo) made in blue vinyl during 1992
Subsequent year models received an "LM" suffix and were produced in black vinyl

Three channels, each with selection switches
Channel 1 (mid shift and bright)
Channel 2 (contrasting crunch modes)
Channel 3 (gain boost and mid band contour selection)
Channel switching by footswitch, midi control, or from front panel switches with LED indicator)

Sensitivity switches, one each for low or high compensation, to match guitar pickup
Power control allows high (4 valve, 100 watts) or low (2 valve, 50 watts) mode output
Pentode or triode mode operation in either mode gives effective power range from 100 down to 25 watts
Power amp damping control for tighter sound and fuller distortion: high, low, or auto.
Auto mode damping pre-selects the right damping to the correct channel

Comprehensive effects loop provides level control, series or parallel selection
Separate send level trim: one each for clean and overdrive channels (-10 to +4 each)
Balanced output with level control features authentic compensation for a real direct to board guitar sound
Impedance selector

NOTE: The 6100 series amplifiers do not have built-in reverb


After reading this, The Marshall seems the way to go.  Sounds extremely flexable and wide ranging.  I might look into one myself smile

Good luck!

DannyG's Website

3 Reply by twistingcrow (edited by twistingcrow 2008-11-08 09:58:51)

  • Registered: 2008-10-27
  • Posts: 176

Re: Fender or Marshall?

Here's what pedals I use, fairly simple:
1 Fulltone Fulldrive 2 custom cream that I use for a clean boost (or can use for a real good OD ala TS808)
1 Holy Grail Reverb
1 Boss DD-3 Delay
That's it, I don't want to be playing with my feet more than with my fingers onstage... Anyway, If my pedals may be the problem I can easily swap or sell them to get other ones, but they seem pretty good for what I play so far...
As far as guitars are concerned: One Fender strat (Warmoth body with Kinman Woodstock pu's) and a stock Gibson Les Paul Standard from 1992.
Cheers!

BTW, I've just seen that I can get a JTM45 clone too at a reasonable price, what would you think of that option? smile

  • From: Sandy Eggo
  • Registered: 2007-04-29
  • Posts: 1,369

Re: Fender or Marshall?

Fender cleans are to die for...I would spring for the Fender and get a nice overdrive pedal that suits you to put in front of it. I'm not talking TS808 blues overdrive, something that'll really kick you in the stomach when you turn it on.

"Music is the only thing that you can share with a million million people and you don't lose, you gain. It helps you to get energy and to live long, because when your soul is very happy then you don't want to die." - Ali Akbar Khan
  • From: North Carolina
  • Registered: 2008-10-26
  • Posts: 2,926

Re: Fender or Marshall?

Musicinmysoul wrote:

Fender cleans are to die for...I would spring for the Fender and get a nice overdrive pedal that suits you to put in front of it. I'm not talking TS808 blues overdrive, something that'll really kick you in the stomach when you turn it on.

I agree Fenders might not have the crunch that a marshall has but if you can get a good clean tone then you can get a good Distortion tone with pedals.  Its much harder to get a amp that distorts too well to sound clean at loud volumes.  As far as the JTM45 clone goes I don't think it or the Fender bassman will distort at lower volumes and if thats what your after the other marshall would be great for that.  Another option would be buy a attenuator such as the THD Hot plate or the Marshall Power Break to turn the power down like a master Volume but still let you get those glorious Power amp and Pre amp sounds come through!

AD3THREE's Website

  • From: Sandy Eggo
  • Registered: 2007-04-29
  • Posts: 1,369

Re: Fender or Marshall?

AD3THREE wrote:

Another option would be buy a attenuator such as the THD Hot plate or the Marshall Power Break to turn the power down like a master Volume but still let you get those glorious Power amp and Pre amp sounds come through!

I've actually got something similar so I can push the tubes in my Fender even playing clean. It's called The Volume Box, they go on eBay for $20. You put them in the loop and it sits right on top of the amp.

"Music is the only thing that you can share with a million million people and you don't lose, you gain. It helps you to get energy and to live long, because when your soul is very happy then you don't want to die." - Ali Akbar Khan
  • Registered: 2007-09-30
  • Posts: 556

Re: Fender or Marshall?

I'd go with the Fender - You know what your are getting, a honest clean amp.  The Marshall I have no experience with, but to me it sounds like your same old 3 channel amp.  Useable? Maybe, too much for me though.  Atleast with the Fender you might go with 2 different overdrives, one to suit you strat tone, one to your les paul tone.  The thing is you will never make a Fender sound like a Marshall, and vice versa.  You'll either sacrifice your cleans for some overdrive, or overdrive for some cleans.  Another thing to consider is the condition of the amps.  Let us know what you choose.

Ben

  • Registered: 2008-10-27
  • Posts: 176

Re: Fender or Marshall?

AD3THREE wrote:
Musicinmysoul wrote:

Fender cleans are to die for...I would spring for the Fender and get a nice overdrive pedal that suits you to put in front of it. I'm not talking TS808 blues overdrive, something that'll really kick you in the stomach when you turn it on.

I agree Fenders might not have the crunch that a marshall has but if you can get a good clean tone then you can get a good Distortion tone with pedals.  Its much harder to get a amp that distorts too well to sound clean at loud volumes.  As far as the JTM45 clone goes I don't think it or the Fender bassman will distort at lower volumes and if thats what your after the other marshall would be great for that.  Another option would be buy a attenuator such as the THD Hot plate or the Marshall Power Break to turn the power down like a master Volume but still let you get those glorious Power amp and Pre amp sounds come through!

I forgot to mention that I already have the THD Hotplate... smile
I get what you mean when you say it's sacrificing cleans for overdrive and vice versa. That's why I was also thinking about the JTM45, which is supposed to have the best cleans Marshall ever made... Has anyone tried it? And I long for that So Many Roads tone...
If you have more tips or ideas as to what to choose, shoot!

  • From: North Carolina
  • Registered: 2008-10-26
  • Posts: 2,926

Re: Fender or Marshall?

Its also my understanding that Marshall used a circuit in their older amps that was similar to the one Fender was using on the Bassman (combo with 4 10s that is.  Also the circuit was  not an original fender design, it belonged to General Electric and was a very common cirucit design in the 50's.)  The difference was Marshall offered 4 12's and a closed back cab and possibly more wattage.  So if that was the case I'd see what was in better condition and also what has the better price because I'm thinking you'll get around the same sound with either head you go with.

AD3THREE's Website

10 Reply by Danny! (edited by Musicinmysoul 2008-11-08 16:18:44)

  • From: Sandy Eggo
  • Registered: 2007-04-29
  • Posts: 1,369

Re: Fender or Marshall?

I don't think you have to sacrifice clean for overdrive at all...there are some phenomenal pedals out there. The Zendrive, a Keeley modded TS808 (for bluesy stuff), and my Tube Driver all come to mind.

Keep in mind that So Many Roads has delay and reverb up the rear, so you've got to incorporate those into your sound if that's your desired result.

Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I wouldn't ever consider using Marshall cleans...

Hi there, my name is Danny, and I'm addicted to Fender clean tones.

"Music is the only thing that you can share with a million million people and you don't lose, you gain. It helps you to get energy and to live long, because when your soul is very happy then you don't want to die." - Ali Akbar Khan
  • Registered: 2007-09-30
  • Posts: 556

Re: Fender or Marshall?

AD3THREE wrote:

Its also my understanding that Marshall used a circuit in their older amps that was similar to the one Fender was using on the Bassman (combo with 4 10s that is.  Also the circuit was  not an original fender design, it belonged to General Electric and was a very common cirucit design in the 50's.)  The difference was Marshall offered 4 12's and a closed back cab and possibly more wattage.  So if that was the case I'd see what was in better condition and also what has the better price because I'm thinking you'll get around the same sound with either head you go with.

Marshall also used a cheap tranny.  It cost them to much to ship over the cheap tranny's Fender was using so they had to porduce their own.  They used el 34's, giving it that difference in tone as well.  Other than that its pretty much the same circuit.

I would honestly stay away from the newer Marshalls, not the same as the vintage ones.  Mass produced junk.  Adding a hot plate will also change the tone dramatically, sounds like its being choked.  Check out Top Hats.  They offer stuff in both the Fender and Marshall camps.  I have the Emplexador 50 and its mint.  I hear great things about their Super Deluxe style amp also.  I also have a Mesa Lone Star which is a fantastic amp.  Nice cleans and dirt.

  • Registered: 2008-10-27
  • Posts: 176

Re: Fender or Marshall?

Thanks for the answers...
I know that the Lone Star is a great amp, the problem is that right here in France I can get an old Fender bassman head for about 1000$, same thing for a good JTM45 clone (I'm thinking Metro Amps). The Lone Star is almost 2000$ here. Mesa Boogie is totally unaffordable in Europe...
For So Many Roads I have the Les Paul, the delay, the reverb, I just need the amp (and the fingers I may add... smile) No JTM45 fans out there? I wonder what Joe would advise if he had to pick one up. Would it be the bassman or bandmaster head, or the JTM45 or 1974X head or the 30th Anniversary head or combo?
Another influence of mine is Jeff Healey, I love his tone too (should say I loved, may his soul rest in peace). He played Marshalls...

  • From: Sandy Eggo
  • Registered: 2007-04-29
  • Posts: 1,369

Re: Fender or Marshall?

I can't find any info on his gear but if Jeff did play Marshalls, they were old.

"Music is the only thing that you can share with a million million people and you don't lose, you gain. It helps you to get energy and to live long, because when your soul is very happy then you don't want to die." - Ali Akbar Khan
  • From: Lancashire
  • Registered: 2008-02-26
  • Posts: 700

Re: Fender or Marshall?

I like jtm45's imo there very clapton :x, but a bassman or jtm hmmm... U thought of ebaying and finding an early fender silverface or blackface deluxe reverb / super>?

  • mitch
  • mitch
  • Gold Member
  • Offline
  • From: Swindon, UK
  • Registered: 2006-04-22
  • Posts: 92

Re: Fender or Marshall?

The key thing with SRV's tone & Mayer's (to some extent) is that they have a very loud but fairly clean tone.  I've got a JTM45 & it does have a cool clean tone- but at around 33 watts you soon run out of headroom- depending on the venues you play of course.  Personally I'd go for the 100w marshall- you have all the headroom you'll need plus the versatility of three channels & the cool Marshall OD which is a key part of Joe's tone.  Very tough to get an amp that does it all, but I reckon the Marshall with do the best job for the stuff you play imho.

This don't look like no express way to me...
  • From: North Carolina
  • Registered: 2008-10-26
  • Posts: 2,926

Re: Fender or Marshall?

mitch wrote:

The key thing with SRV's tone & Mayer's (to some extent) is that they have a very loud but fairly clean tone.  I've got a JTM45 & it does have a cool clean tone- but at around 33 watts you soon run out of headroom- depending on the venues you play of course.  Personally I'd go for the 100w marshall- you have all the headroom you'll need plus the versatility of three channels & the cool Marshall OD which is a key part of Joe's tone.  Very tough to get an amp that does it all, but I reckon the Marshall with do the best job for the stuff you play imho.

I agree with this too.  If you listen to John Mayall and the Blues Breakers with Eric Clapton (The Beano Album)  He's playing the heck out of a Marshall combo and a les Paul and maybe a range master pedal so I hear.  That is a cranked sound but its not 100 watts of hell like he had in Cream.  Its just a loud fat tone.  If you listen to EC now what does he play?  A 1950's Fender Twin with his Strat.  Both of those amps are linked to being good fat sounding amps but screamers no.  Which brings me back to my point 3 or 4 post ago... if you can get a GOOD clean sound YOU can get a Good distortion sound.  If you look at it like that its clear as mud.  wink

AD3THREE's Website

17 Reply by twistingcrow (edited by twistingcrow 2008-11-09 14:45:25)

  • Registered: 2008-10-27
  • Posts: 176

Re: Fender or Marshall?

Looks like there are some Fender and Marshall addicts out there...
I'll let you know what I decide between the Bassman and the JTM45. I don't play large venues, most of the time it's just 100 people, not many more (so far...) so I think that getting a 100 watter may be a little too much for me, even with a THD Hotplate (though I may be wrong since I have the hotplate...). And besides having a 100 watter head means getting a 4X12 or it's useless, so... I was thinking a 2X12, not more...
Other opinions?
Thanks! smile

I guess that if Joe doesn't post on this one I'll have to ask him in person in 7 days... I can't wait... smile

  • SRVTWO
  • SRVTWO
  • Silver Member
  • Offline
  • Registered: 2007-12-03
  • Posts: 59

Re: Fender or Marshall?

I actually remember Joe making a comment on the 30th anniversary Marshall saying it was a great amp.  Its around here somwhere.  I own a couple bassman heads and they are great amps, people do lots of mods on them and they take pedals well.  The one thing about them though they are very revealing esp. if you dont use any reverb.  Every mistake you make is way out there.  The Marshall would actually be my choice as I have heard they have a great clean channel and overdrive channel.  With the bassman you will need a pedal or mods to get distortion.  Fender Bassman heads are still pretty easy to come by, maybe not so on the Marshall.  If you are getting a good deal go with the Marshall.
Mike