UK Tour (Page 1 of 3)

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"He still doesn't charge for mistakes! "
http://jbonamassa.com/tour-dates/
"Everybody wants ta get inta the act!"
“Now, this isn’t your ordinary party crowd, here.  I mean, there are professionals in here.”

ummm, Radio City Hall one of the premier venues in the word and Hammersmith Odeon.... a disused cinema on a one-way system in a rough area of London....

Sometimes one must travel. Joe played a number of shows in Europe in 2014. He played 10 times in the UK in 2013, then he took a year off from the UK with his regular show, but did play a festival or two this past summer there. He takes a year off from places in the US. Traveling to different countries in Europe and the UK is akin to traveling to different states in the US except you guys have a much better train system. The man can't be everywhere and please everyone all the time. Prices have risen in the UK and they are now similar to what we've been paying for a while in the US. He, his band and crew put on one of the best, most professional concerts in the world and to do that it costs money. You have two choices, if you enjoy it and feel it's worth it, you pay and go, if you feel otherwise you don't buy a ticket. It's that simple, make a choice and be done with it.

A couple of points:

1. You appear to have a very simplified view of the ease and cost of travel in the UK - for two people to travel by train from, say, Newcastle to London, stay one night in what passes for a cheap hotel  there and buy two tickets for the Apollo theatre would cost over 1000 dollars. You might not think that is a lot of money, but I'm pretty sure a lot of people in Britain do...which is presumably why the shows are still not sold out.

2. Of course Joe can't be everywhere, but you only have to look at the negative press he has received both on this forum and on social media to realize that many of his loyal fans genuinely feel that they have been let down. As we are not in their position (we live in Germany), I personally don't feel I'm entitled to question or pass judgement on their feelings...

It is that darn VAT Phil. JK I have only been in London once but I tell the story about exchanging $1,000 for 600 pounds that spent like $400. There is nothing cheap about London. I would compare it to NYC which is an expensive town too but London was a shock to the system and then you add that VAT and ouch. I feel your pain and understand your concerns not only for ticket pricing but not choosing to do other dates in the UK. Now we all know that Joe reads the forum so you can be sure he sees the feedback good and bad.

The reality is no explanation no matter how good it is can make everybody happy. There is always the concern about ticket prices and time between markets. I know my market and have strong opinions that I can express in public and in private but I do not pretend to know any other market and most of all the economic condition of other markets such as disposable income of the residents, the demographic of the audience, and all the other Macro economic conditions of the country itself.

I do predict Friday and Saturday sellouts by show date. Maybe the Tuesday, Thursday shows have some seats empty and possibly 3 nights will sell out. A partial sellout on Tuesday may still work out better than travel to another market. As to speculation in another thread about advertising that may not be necessary if ticket prices were lower. I know that there is an advertising budget set for each market and it is spent whether the show sells out on the initial pre-sale or has seats available day of show.

J&R have made very few mistakes over the years and one of the ways they have reached the level Joe is at is the willingness to take a chance and bet on themselves. If there is a miscalculation on their part in assessing the value of their tickets and the demand for them in the London market I will be surprised but that doesn't mean it can't happen. I would think the only change in sales are the speed in which the shows sell. Here in Oklahoma where we have 3 million in the entire state and very few shows of any artist ever sells out we are a walk up town in many respects. I have always dreamed of selling out one show in advance.

London metro is 11 times our metro population and selling out 4 shows in advance to me would be a feat. Especially if the venue is not considered a prime venue by the residents. Again anecdotal evidence cited when I say Joe plays the Civic Center here and is preferred however it was not available for the last show and an alternate venue was secured. It was an arena and although the arena was cut to 1/4 capacity and the seating was actually better over all, nobody really likes the arena around here for concerts so I know it affected sales. Still out sold the Civic Center capacity but I would of loved to of sold that mother out once first.

I agree with you and that is indeed a consequence as there have been consequences with every move that has been made since I began following Joe. There are those that have not followed Joe through the lineup changes and the producer influence but that is limited to individual tastes. Now the common denominator is financial concerns that most people all share to a certain degree and there could be an argument made that all along the way there were some people priced out. There has been talk on other social media that some have chosen to not see consecutive nights because of the ticket prices. There are people that long for the Borderline and 200 capacity 10 pound tickets. I'm not defending nor agreeing with the pricing structure.

Now I have been a fan of Joe's for sometime and I may be in the minority but early on I wanted to see Joe play bigger and fewer shows so he wouldn't burn out. I wanted to see him more comfortable on the road. For example a bus. All those goals have been obtained and along the way are gone the once a year shows at a 500 seat room. I personally believe that people want to see the show and will pay what they can afford as long as it is worth the price of admission and the seat is a good seat. Not having ever been to the Apollo i'm not sure what the less expensive seats are like and my opinion is that you can over price the cheap seats. I personally wouldn't sit in a crappy seat for any price and I mean free. However if some one wants to see a show and they have limited financial resources there needs to be an option however the long time fans may still feel slighted because they may have that option to attend the show but may not want to sit in the back for the same price it got elbows on the stage at some point in the past. 

Alienating fans is always a possibility no matter what you do. It is a gamble however you look at it. Joe is bringing a different show to London and every time he has done that and every time ticket prices have risen people complain. Until the show plays and then he quiets the critics. He has weathered blowback before. The Borderline ticketing from Tour De Force had those same long time fans crying fowl and I for one felt for them but there was not a good way to handle that show. Limited tickets available and a large core fan base made that impossible to please everybody. The best way to of handled that is invitation only but that would of pissed people off as well.

All people can really do is decide if they want to see the show at whatever ticket price currently set and if it is out of their budget then they can refuse to go. They can and will come on here and cry foul. Joe comes here for feed back and gets it in spades especially from the UK where there is a larger fanbase that has watched his growth from the Kenny and Eric faze till today. So I agree that rising ticket prices can alienate long time fans whether they think he is gouging or just reflecting rising costs of doing business and I won't engage in the argument that his prices have been rising at a faster rate than inflation or actual costs because macro and micro economics as it relates to Joe's business model is none of my business.

I checked the bands listed for the average ticket price in the US and it is similar as the UK and yes if that is the average price for a show in that venue then Joe is way above average. My guess if his tickets were priced at that level then it would of sold out reasonably quick and the only people to reap the benefits of the secondary market  would be the touts as you call them I believe. Scalpers here. I do believe that the cheap seats should be in this range personally. But I believe if someone is willing to pay $150 to sit up close then that should go to the artist. In Joe's model that is the way it seems to work. Again I'm not familiar with this venue and don't know what the seating is like. I personally like multiple price point scaling in a venue. We could argue and discuss this to death and again this is one of those topics that gets much attention and rightly so. It still boils down to value but in the concert world it is about average ticket price and average number sold. It is a business. The discussion on this particular show will come to an end in March. If ticket prices needs to be adjusted up or down or the venue moved to another location then I'm sure future shows will reflect that decision.

Thanks Jim.

As you say the discussion re ticket prices is becoming less relevant as two of the nights are pretty much sold out.

I would be interested to hear a bit more about the new format of the London dates?

Lester.