Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

ZeyerGTR wrote:

Just giving my thoughts, stream-of-conscious style as I go through the finalists.  I liked about half of them.  Congrats to all the finalists, and to all the folks that entered.  Regardless of the results, it was fun to do and a good learning experience.

#1 - Pretty surprised at the winner.  To be honest I saw a lot of takes I liked better, but congrats to him.  What a great opportunity.

I thought the #2 entry was pretty good - he had nice vibrato and played some interesting lines over the track.  A little sloppy here and there, but at least he had decent rhythm for most of it.  Not super-bluesy, but then, the Story of a Quarryman is more of a rock track anyways.

#3- Ouch, painfully out-of-tune bend there...  had to stop shortly thereafter.

I think #4 was pretty good.  Maybe a bit too "shreddy" for a blues contest, but still some bluesy bits, and at least he could play in time.  He did a good job of keeping it interesting.

#5 sounded great - very polished.  Good timing, good bends, nice vibrato, bluesy feel.  My favorite of the bunch, and one of a very small few I could actually watch all the way through.

#6 (lap steel one) - not bad, nothing that totally blew me away but nothing super offensive either.

#7 - nice ideas, but so out of tune on that intro... I almost turned it off after the first 20 seconds, but some of the rest of it was better.  Kind of on-and-off.  I liked some aspects of what he was doing, though, and at least he looked like he getting was into it.

#8 - I think this one was pretty good throughout.  Lots the groove here and there, but for for the most part it was solid.  Nice phrasing, some interesting lines and at he was pretty much in tune and had some vibrato.  Not my favorite entry, but one of the better ones among the finalists.  It did get a little long - I was getting bored by the end and would have liked some more up and down throughout, but still a great take.  I liked #5 better, but this was right up there.

#9 - the intro seemed off rhythmically, but I did really dig his tone and phrasing on the take overall.  Pretty good job.  I kept hoping he'd "take it somewhere" [Edit- he finally did about 3 minutes in] but what he did play was well done (intro aside). I also really liked that he left some space in there.  So many entries didn't - just a steady stream of notes from start to finish.  Rhythm and phrasing were good, too.

I saw the #10 entry a while back, one of the better ones I'd seen throughout.  Not my favorite, but reasonably solid.  Took him a little while to get into the groove, and a bit too shreddy and not bluesy enough for my taste at some point, but not bad overall.

I am glad some of the folks that appeared to have bought points (70k, 60k, etc) didn't make it.  I didn't think their entries were very good, and their point counts were suspicious to say the least.


I think this is a pretty fair assessment.  I think the biggest surprises for me where 3, 6, 7. 

For #3, I guess I'd just expect that a "blues master' would be abel to bend a note in tune.  Other than that, the phrasing just seems very mechanical.

For #6, the guy pretty much plays the same rhythmic figure throughout the entire track.  I agree, nothing offensive but didn't really seem like he had command of the instrument.

For #7, It is really out of tune for a lot of the track and really difficult to hear most of what is going on most of the time.  Maybe I just didn't understand the phrasing and note choice...but it just sounds like he's playing notes from the scale (and often times not in any scale) instead of developing an idea or playing something that is melodic.

In general, this is a lot of time to ask someone to solo if they aren't a very good improvisor.  To be clear, being a good improvisor is more about creating and developing musical ideas and creating a story than it is about how fast you can play.  On most of these videos you can tell the point where they player is out of ideas and just starts playing the same kinds of things over an over again.  Or you have a lot of filler licks and then a new idea, followed by the same filler licks until the next idea comes.  Another thing you see is a build in intensity but then the player reaches a point where they don't have the technique to take it to the next level so they just sorta keep going with the same intensity so instead of getting a sense of movement, there is just a point where it's loud and it stays loud for a while.  I judge a solo by how good the musical narrative is because I'm an improvisor.  I feel like what Joe was looking for (or at least more moved by) was more of the rock guitar mentality of flashy licks/tricks and attitude.

Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

In general, this is a lot of time to ask someone to solo if they aren't a very good improvisor.

Definitely, I agree 100%, although there's nothing that says this had to be improvisation.  The point stands regardless.  IMHO, the real challenge of this competition was "how do you take a 4 minute piece not written as an instrumental and make it interesting as an instrumental?"  A lot of the takes (not just the finalists, but across the board) came across as a 4 minute stream of notes and licks without much up and down, or continuity between them.  You've got to play enough to keep it interesting, but not so much you're going to fatigue a listener (or bore them by just repeating essentially the same thing over and over, like you said).

39 (edited by clinchmtnmojo 2013-07-24 01:12:05)

Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

Yea gotta say man, I thought this contest would be different from all the rest...mainly because it had Joe's name attached to it. And obviously the 'blues' word attached to it turned out to stand for something different than I originally thought as well.
Im not anywhere near the top or even a weekly winner or anything like that. Im not disappointed in my 'not winning'- nor does my face appear as if Id eaten sour grapes or whatever that crap was?(more on that later) but I am honestly disappointed in Joe- or rather, what I percieved Joe as, I guess.
When you feel as if you relate to someone because you relate to their music, you feel like if a contest were to be judged by that person that you or everyone else would be judged upon equal ground. Like "oh well Joe is gonna watch the vids, so I know thats an extremely knowledgable person on the 'blues'. Im not bashin Joe, Im just puttin my feelings about my experience in entering this contest. And Im sure a lot of the other guys know what Im talkin about that entered.

Now for anyone that did NOT enter the contest to say somethin like “its time to move on" or "this thread is done" is frankly a slap in the face. When you put your life & family on hold for days just to connect 7 different devices to record something that lasts 3-4mins, then connect another 5 devices to post it on the internet, create 3 new accounts, read thru the most abstract set of rules you've ever seen 10 different times, and then harass every friend & family member you have to go watch a video you made of yourself playin to someone else's music.....MAN, please. Give me a break. Go find a forum for spectators if thats all you got to add to this subject. I feel like you should invest in iTunes for like $1.29 and buy Bob Dylan's song -Positively 4th Street. But no hard feelings. I will stop my rambling now so that I may avoid the risk of sounding 'obsessive'.
I will say ZeYer, that was a fairly accurate review.

heres my video to the 'Blues' contest
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ds5lS0eTBMM

AR

Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

right on aaron,i worked hard on this thing and so did alot of other folk's,now i know i shouldn't have won because i was sloppy and redundant ,however there were some great players that could play circles around some of the finalists, as far as moving on ,i did ,i'll try again next year,but i speak my mind ,if something is wrong i'm gonna let you know about it,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMzuMOsCQGs

41 (edited by JBFan4Life 2013-07-24 19:04:43)

Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

Hey wait a minute....did everyone contributing to this thread actually enter?  I think not.

I'll move on, nonetheless.  Thanks for the reminder.  Sorry if I reddened anyone's face, with a figurative smack upside their "cheek".  Cheeky is, as cheeky does, if I may butcher a phrase.

I've no right to make observations around here.  I'm just a bystander.  (Next thing you know, I'll be accused of living under a bridge....)

Didn't mean to leave anyone feeling "Mistreated" -- Burn, Deep Purple.

Play like you've worked at it, and don't worry about sounding like your influences.  You can't cheat on them, or your practice, anyway.  If you've worked hard at your skill, your audience will know it.

Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

I was not aware that the in order to comment you had to have entered

"Joe B saved my soul, forever grateful Ron"
"Some people dream of worthy accomplishments while others stay awake and do them"
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Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

shanew07 wrote:

I'm disappointed in the top ten.  No amazing players and several bad ones.   We shouldn't be hearing tin-can tones and out of tune bending from finalists in a competition with 2600 entrants.   I feel like they picked the slide player and the dobro player just to include some different instruments  Oh well...it was fun and I wish them all the best.

Here's mine again if anyone else is interested in seeing it before I take it down.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=plcp … 9Pjd9qZBvw

Check out Bandofjimis channel on YouhTube The Whale That Swallowed Jonah and let me
Know what you think!

Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

cindyron wrote:

I was not aware that the in order to comment you had to have entered

Naw, that's not what he said.  I understood him to mean unless you entered and did the work, it was a bit ballsy to tell anyone to move on or close the thread.  That's all.  Comments are fine.

You know yourself If you put you heart & soul into a project, it becomes personal.  I do think a deep breath by all would be timely so we can keep

muchlove
fdol

Rock On & Keep the FAITH
             It is
Blues From the Bottoms

Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

JBFan4Life wrote:

Hey wait a minute....did everyone contributing to this thread actually enter?  I think not.

I'll move on, nonetheless.  Thanks for the reminder.  Sorry if I reddened anyone's face, with a figurative smack upside their "cheek".  Cheeky is, as cheeky does, if I may butcher a phrase.

I've no right to make observations around here.  I'm just a bystander.  (Next thing you know, I'll be accused of living under a bridge....)

Didn't mean to leave anyone feeling "Mistreated" -- Burn, Deep Purple.


You have every "right" on an internet forum to wax poetic about things you don't understand...I'm pretty sure that's what internet forums are for actually.  You (and cindyron) also have the right to come in to a perfectly reasonable conversation and declare "you people should stop talking about this" but you probably shouldn't be too surprised when it's not well received.  I guess you even have the "right" to make nasty comments like: "Join the fun, and worry less about how you failed." but I don't really understand what your motivation could be other than to make a personal attack.

Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

I took the thread title at face value - let's discuss the finalists.  If there aren't personal attacks, or posts that are unnecessarily nasty, then it's just a discussion.  Feel free to post your thoughts about the finalists.  It was interesting to go through and listen to them all, and interesting to hear what people liked and didn't.  I really liked #9 - it was one of my favorites.  A friend of mine (who also entered) absolutely hated that one.  Diff'rent strokes for diff'rent folks.

I put a lot of time into my submission (link in my sig) as well, but I'm under no illusions that it was the be-all and end-all.  I'm proud of what it was, and I learned a lot working on it.  It's a reflection of where I'm at as a player right now, given a specific challenge, and so be it.  Same for everyone else.  I do like it better than most of what I've seen, but I'm also well aware of some aspects I didn't do as well as I could have.  I think most people need to have more open, honest ears about what they submitted.  For all the faults of the finalists' submissions, I listened to pretty much everyone else's take on the main contest thread, and I hear lots of issues with those as well.  I'm happy to receive feedback about my playing, but it's hard to give feedback on a message board, especially if it isn't asked for, because it comes off as an attack.  Just doesn't seem appropriate.  I would just say, listen carefully and be as critical of yourself as you are of the finalists.  If you can find something to work on, learn from and improve in your playing, then you're a winner.

Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

ZeyerGTR wrote:

I took the thread title at face value - let's discuss the finalists.  If there aren't personal attacks, or posts that are unnecessarily nasty, then it's just a discussion.  Feel free to post your thoughts about the finalists.  It was interesting to go through and listen to them all, and interesting to hear what people liked and didn't.  I really liked #9 - it was one of my favorites.  A friend of mine (who also entered) absolutely hated that one.  Diff'rent strokes for diff'rent folks.

I put a lot of time into my submission (link in my sig) as well, but I'm under no illusions that it was the be-all and end-all.  I'm proud of what it was, and I learned a lot working on it.  It's a reflection of where I'm at as a player right now, given a specific challenge, and so be it.  Same for everyone else.  I do like it better than most of what I've seen, but I'm also well aware of some aspects I didn't do as well as I could have.  I think most people need to have more open, honest ears about what they submitted.  For all the faults of the finalists' submissions, I listened to pretty much everyone else's take on the main contest thread, and I hear lots of issues with those as well.  I'm happy to receive feedback about my playing, but it's hard to give feedback on a message board, especially if it isn't asked for, because it comes off as an attack.  Just doesn't seem appropriate.  I would just say, listen carefully and be as critical of yourself as you are of the finalists.  If you can find something to work on, learn from and improve in your playing, then you're a winner.

Linda and I are attending the finals this week thanks to the generous offer from ST Andy and are awaiting word on how and when.  big_smile.  We'll be getting some vids (if allowed) and will post so folks can see how well they do in real live situations. It's one thing to produce at home and totally another live. I've seen them choke and flop at prior finals.

One note to any finalists reading this. CHECK THE AMP SETUP! It was sad to see a contestant who was pretty good end up with cables cutting out when she plugged in. there were two furnished rigs onstage and one was way better than the other.  Redos weren't allowed. Stage presence and confidence count more than technical skills. Please the crowd and the judges will notice. Good luck to all.

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Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

ZeyerGTR wrote:

I took the thread title at face value - let's discuss the finalists.  If there aren't personal attacks, or posts that are unnecessarily nasty, then it's just a discussion.  Feel free to post your thoughts about the finalists.  It was interesting to go through and listen to them all, and interesting to hear what people liked and didn't.  I really liked #9 - it was one of my favorites.  A friend of mine (who also entered) absolutely hated that one.  Diff'rent strokes for diff'rent folks.

I put a lot of time into my submission (link in my sig) as well, but I'm under no illusions that it was the be-all and end-all.  I'm proud of what it was, and I learned a lot working on it.  It's a reflection of where I'm at as a player right now, given a specific challenge, and so be it.  Same for everyone else.  I do like it better than most of what I've seen, but I'm also well aware of some aspects I didn't do as well as I could have.  I think most people need to have more open, honest ears about what they submitted.  For all the faults of the finalists' submissions, I listened to pretty much everyone else's take on the main contest thread, and I hear lots of issues with those as well.  I'm happy to receive feedback about my playing, but it's hard to give feedback on a message board, especially if it isn't asked for, because it comes off as an attack.  Just doesn't seem appropriate.  I would just say, listen carefully and be as critical of yourself as you are of the finalists.  If you can find something to work on, learn from and improve in your playing, then you're a winner.

yeah i thought #9 was pretty good. Cheers ron

"Joe B saved my soul, forever grateful Ron"
"Some people dream of worthy accomplishments while others stay awake and do them"
Skinner #1,JBLP 145(aged),252, (unaged),#285HM, Bburst #026, Joes 052 BCC black LP, Strat> RT,EC Gilmour,Beck,Lenny LP> PK 83,CC#2,3,4,9,Amps>Carol Ann RAH JB-100 SN 001,JB100 Red SN02,OD2, OD3,Tucana 2&3 Triptix,Twinkle land, Plexi ,JB Jub, Jubs,Plexi,Satch,Two Rock>others

Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

ZeyerGTR wrote:

I put a lot of time into my submission (link in my sig) as well, but I'm under no illusions that it was the be-all and end-all.  I'm proud of what it was, and I learned a lot working on it.  It's a reflection of where I'm at as a player right now, given a specific challenge, and so be it.  Same for everyone else.  I do like it better than most of what I've seen, but I'm also well aware of some aspects I didn't do as well as I could have.  I think most people need to have more open, honest ears about what they submitted.  For all the faults of the finalists' submissions, I listened to pretty much everyone else's take on the main contest thread, and I hear lots of issues with those as well.  I'm happy to receive feedback about my playing, but it's hard to give feedback on a message board, especially if it isn't asked for, because it comes off as an attack.  Just doesn't seem appropriate.  I would just say, listen carefully and be as critical of yourself as you are of the finalists.  If you can find something to work on, learn from and improve in your playing, then you're a winner.

I think in the end it's a really good exercise to record your playing and have a chance to pick it apart.  I listen back to stuff I recorded 10 years ago and I get to hear the ideas I had then, both good an bad.  I'm often surprised to realize that even though my approach has evolved, I still like some of the old ideas I may have left behind.

I think talking about musical ideas is always a really helpful exercise because it's not in the heat of battle when you're ripping out a solo.  I usually play poorly when I try to manufacture a solo by thinking too much because it starts to sound forced.  I think the key is to get new ideas in your ears so you can hear them in the context of your playing style and have the technique down to the point where it doesn't require conscious thought to execute.  That's a lot easier to say than to do though.

Here's what I submitted: http://bluesmasters.yoov.io/channels/nathan+lee

Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

Rick has uploaded three performances so far here is his channel http://www.youtube.com/user/Elexmage go to recent uploads. Soon to be more but so far the performances are all amazingly good. Even better than the entries they submitted. the first was the eventual winner. Tough choice if they were all this good.

51 (edited by RickB 2013-07-29 12:19:54)

Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

jim m wrote:

Rick has uploaded three performances so far here is his channel http://www.youtube.com/user/Elexmage go to recent uploads. Soon to be more but so far the performances are all amazingly good. Even better than the entries they submitted. the first was the eventual winner. Tough choice if they were all this good.

Jim, I was amazed at the players that Joe selected to appear. They were guys like a lot of the players on this forum I'd say, Some were semi pro players with a lot of years under their belts, others young guns with skills. Dean and I were standing outside during the last sound checks  grinning in anticipation. These fellows were totally worthy. I'll try and get all the clips up by Wednesday before we take off for the 4 day festival in Mammoth. I really liked the gent that played the double neck lap steel with wah, and the luthier that brought his own beautiful hand made resonator and played some wicked slide.
Edit: I have the headers wrong for the most part. Jack Fossett sent me a ms saying it was not him on that clip. He sent me the proper order so I'm going to redo the ones I posted in error. That will teach me to take a pen and paper. Maybe it was the two double gins I had or that old man memory.... hmm When Joe's buying the rounds and I have a designated driver, it tends to make me swill a bit more. smile
edit 2: Jack Fossett who corrected my mis post sent me a little snippet I'll quote,
"I actually do remember, when I got to a spot where the music was different than what we practiced, I channeled some licks from an original tune of mine which was in part inspired by Happier Times to begin with"
Imagine how a player reacts when the band changes up in mid tune under that pressure. Maybe Joe tossed that at them on all the songs to see who would come up with a good result.

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Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

Wow. I watched a LOT of submissions and I must say, respectfully…what the hell happened? A few really good players, but seriously these are the TOP ten?  Sorry Joe B., this may be a contest, but it's not about the best Blues Guitarist…SO disappointed in the entire process. Please rethink getting involved in anything like this again…it dramatically taints your amazing skills and reputation.

Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

Matt Hines the third one of the top ten has been chosen as the winner (I'd spare your time leaving a comment about the top 10 finalists with just saying I feel the same way as you all do!) . I did the same track "The whale that swallowed Jonah" and as far as I know I was in the top100, my video received strong support not only from the US ,but also England, Germany, Spain, Japan, Belgium ,Croatia , Bulgaria, & Tahiti (don't ask how many nights me my friends and family didn't sleep trying to promote the thing all over the world!) ,because of the positive feedback received from die-hard JB fans, sound engineers ,& pro-musicians I happened to believe that my video is one of the many well qualified entries that were overlooked. What do you guys think ? here is my video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHMKxs0BdA8

Re: Blues Masters 2013 Finalists! What do you think?

What do I think?  I think I made a good decision to avoid this contest, entries, and subject altogether. 

Don't ask for more than that. Yet.

Congratulations are in order! What an honor the 10 must've felt!

Awaiting the shared finalist program material in earnest now. smile


Rock ON & Keep the Faith,
Rocket

"He still doesn't charge for mistakes! wink"
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