copying licks (Page 1 of 2)

I often learn licks from other players note for note - just to get my fingers doing something different and to explore new ideas.

I almost NEVER play those licks when gigging... Just doesn't feel right to me.

I'll just stick to the same 4 note lick that I have been playing for 25 years now... 

No, seriously - I use those other licks to learn from and to hopefully expand my own lick vocabulary.  Lately, I have been working with my teacher to move away from standard 'canned' licks and start playing what I hear in my head.  Much harder, but much more satisfying.  Then again, there is nothing to say that what I hear in my head isn't someone else's lick that I have heard before... 

thanks everyone for the great replies...Devan...playing something i hear in my head is always something i've wanted to develop. If i listen to a guitar solo once i can often play it first time because i recognise most of the notes. My problem is improvising on the spot - i cant hear in my head the next lick im going to play because im occupied with the lick im playing. Any advice?

thanks!:)

thanks so much man! yeah i've been self taught for about 2 and a half years now...but i've recently gotten a teacher whose been playing for 40 odd years so ill see where that takes me!:P

thanks again for the insightful stuff!

i'll give that a shot...ive always heard people say play from your heart not your head

that's actually a very interesting way of looking at it - taking a lick, analysing and improving

EDIT: The continuous flowing licks that Joe does often ... for example in this video at 3:08 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Yg7I5WX … re=related

are these just patterns that he's practised and he can transcribe them to any position on the fretboard?

thanks man!

It's fine to steal licks from other players - that's how 90% of the greats learned.  Where you get into trouble is

1) trying to jam licks in where they don't fit - this is a hard habit to break and happens all the time
2) that's all you play

At some point you've got to move beyond licks, especially other people's licks.  You need to develop your own voice on the instrument.   After all, what have you got to say?  Nothing wrong with learning from them and using them, but it's probably going to be pretty boring and "canned" if you don't add your own unique voice.  Blues isn't about playing things note for note.  If I wanted to hear Muddy Waters or SRV note for note I'd listen to Muddy Waters or SRV (unless you're in a tribute band or something).

Same here - I've been playing a little over 20 years and the more I learn, the more I realize how little I know.  I'm more excited about playing guitar now than I was when I was 18!  If only I had as much free time...

Despite what I'm about to say about not focusing on the details, there are a few common things you'll probably have to do: do not firmly anchor your hand on the bridge, and do not pick from your elbow.  If you anchor your hand it will cause problems when playing across strings, and if you pick from the elbow you're going to hit a brick wall at some point (not to mention risk some physical pain).

Now, here's my 2c: there is no shortcut to great technique, you just have to put the time in.  There is also no one "right" technique - there's a right technique for everyone, but you have to discover what it is for yourself.  A lot of technique videos try to tell you to hold the pick like this or like that, or to pick from the wrist or fingers, etc.  They're going about it backwards.  Focus on the sound of the notes first, and how comfortable it feels, then how you hold the pick will work itself out.  This has been very effective for me,  I'd been playing 20 years before doing this and it's already paying dividends after just a few hours:

Do not worry about open hand, closed hand, what angle you're hitting the strings, or all those details.  They will work themselves out in a way that's best for you.  Look at Steve Morse, EVH or Yngwie - they all hold the pick kind of weird, but it's very successful for them.  Joe Bonamassa's technique and Steve Vai's technique are different, but it works for them.  Eric Johnson has really great technique - probably a good starting point, watch some videos of him.  The point is that you need to give yourself time and practice enough to discover what works for you.  You may need to spend time exploring different ones before you realize what works (check out youtube clips of a variety of players and see what's out there).  Try different things and give yourself plenty of time to see if it's really not right for you, or if it's just an initial awkward phase of doing things differently.

What you need to do is sit down for an hour or more at a time*, and do a variety of exercises at a nice, slow tempo with a metronome, focusing on the sound of the notes.  Try to make each and every note clear and beautiful.  Pay attention to the feel of the pick and your hands when you flub a string skipping exercise, and when you play it perfectly.  You're going to adjust the pick in your fingers, and adjust your wrist and hand.  That's fine, let yourself do it.  Over time, you will discover the right technique for you because it sounds the best, and is most comfortable.  The point isn't to get good at alternate picking in X hours, it's to get good.  It might take you 40 hours, it might take 200, but you'll never get there if you don't practice it and let yourself find what works for you.  Every half an hour or so, take a minute break and stretch.

There are tons of exercises out there if you google or search youtube.  Find a couple that work and get really, really, excrutiatingly comfortable with them.  Then play them more.  The point isn't the exercise - the notes are irrelevant.  You're not working on music, you're working on technique.  You want to have your brain on autopilot as far as the notes go so that your body can absorb what's happening and adjust based on the feedback your ear is getting (do the notes sound good).  It is a good idea to find some that involve string skipping as well as both inside and outside picking.  These are what typically trip up your alternate picking.  Make sure some of the exercises involve triplets because it will force you to start on both up and down strokes, again something that trips people up a lot.  Make sure you do everything with a metronome, slow enough where it's comfortable.  It's fine if you want to crank up the speed every so often to see how you can keep up (and pay attention to how your wrist and fingers feel when playing much, much faster), but again, you don't want your brain occupied by trying to keep up with the music.  Going too slow may not expose flaws.  Going too fast will make it too easy to skip over or not notice flaws.  Keep the tempo nice and easy, but not stupidly slow, and mix it up every so often to see how you do.

Don't fall into the trap of "I played it right 3 times in a row at this tempo, now speed up 5bpm."  It's a trap, it doesn't help in the long run. Maybe you got it right 3 times, but that's probably luck.  Can you play it perfectly 100 times in a row?  It doesn't matter whether you play it at 60bpm or 120bpm - is every note clear and articulate, and is your body comfortable (meaning no wrist cramps)?  That's the point, not some arbitrary number on a machine.  If you can play it perfectly slow, you'll eventually be able to play it perfectly fast.  If you can only play it slow "sometimes" you'll never be able to play it fast.

*I've tried doing this 15-30 minutes at a time and it hasn't worked.  My brain and body really needs an hour or so to start absorbing it, start forgetting that I'm working on technique, and really get the most out of it.  You need to be able to concentrate on the sound and the feeling and have plenty of time to absorb what your body and ears are telling you.  Like I said, there are no shortcuts.  However, I guarantee that after a few dozen hours of practicing alternate picking like this you'll be much better than if you spent the same time just noodling.  You need to focus on, concentrate on, and practice your technique so that when you want to actually play music you don't have to think about it.  It is just part of your playing.

Now, there are great guitar players who break these rules and never did anything like this.  Of course.  I'm talking about alternate picking technique, not making music.  You can have lousy technique and be a great player, but you might need good technique to express yourself.  Depends what you want to play.  If you want to play Eric Johnson or John Petrucci stuff (or Joe Bonamassa), you're going to need the chops.

I wish I had done this 20 years ago, I'd be a heck of a lot better.  Just my 2c.

Hello

thank you so much for the great reply! I am so grateful that you took the time to write all that to help me out man!:) i have read your reply several times and have absorbed everything you said - and you talk sense for a young 17 year old like me! One thing i am still confused about though is wrist movement - to understand what im feeling put your hand on a flat surface and move it as far left as possible (As if youre moving up the strings) its really limited isnt it? this becomes a much bigger issue when standing up and the guitar is angled upwards and it becomes nearly impossible to reach the B or G string from the E string without being in a lot of discomfort. Is the solution to (and im hesitant of saying arm here because i know youre supposed to pick from the wrist) move your arm vertically upwards when moving to the lower strings so your wrist can keep the same position?

i hope you understand my question!:)

HoosierRock...yes i agree with everything you said - listening to shredding all night can become very boring and repetitive!