• Registered: 2010-05-21
  • Posts: 121

Topic: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

Hi,

I've been playing guitar for more than 20 years, but have still quite a few things to learn about amps.

I'm looking for a new amp, and Carol Ann is my first choice - for now. If you have two similar amps, one 50w and one 100w, what will the difference in sound be? I guess the 100w play a little bit louder, but not necessarily much. I've been reading a lot, and the word more headroom appears very often. That's nice to know - if and only if you know what it means!! I guess there's a Norwegian word for it, but never heard it. Therefore I actually don't know what it means. Anyone who dear trying explain this? :-)

I'm playing mostly in rather small clubs and wonder if a 100w is overkill for my use. I have a JVM410 100w, and never seems to be happy with the sound. Possibly because I don't crank it. My 50w Reeves is a different story. Heavenly tone, even at lower volumes. How is the Carol Ann OD2 100w behaving on lower volumes?

Finding a new amp is difficult, and since there's a very limited access to amps in the local stores, I'm stuck with reading and watching reviews online. Any suggestions for a crunchy bluesrock amps? For blues I prefer the sound of Gary Moore, Joe off course and the crunch of CAE (3+, PT100 etc) i find very attractive. That kind of sound will suit my playing I believe. Will the Carol Ann make me happy? I use a little bit more gain than both the late Gary and guess I'll continue doing so. However, ,after I got the Reeves, I have reduced the gain (and effect levels), so the amp's qualities are indeed influencing my pedal settings.

The only way to find THE amp, is to try many different ones, and choose the one that really makes you smile. But when the local stores only has the

  • From: The Netherlands
  • Registered: 2010-02-14
  • Posts: 318

Re: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

I can tell you 2 things.

1. I have a Marshall that has a 100w - 50w switch. You can hear the difference but the 100W mode has more headroom.
2. I had a talk with Nik (from Ceriatone) lately and he told me that 100W is only twice as much as 10W.

I hope that helped maybe?

Rick

I don't charge for mistakes. - Joe Bonamassa
  • From: N.Wales, UK
  • Registered: 2009-03-06
  • Posts: 2,183

Re: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

A lot of it is also feel for the player...that cannot be recognised by 99% of listeners.

4 Reply by André (edited by André 2011-02-18 15:08:47)

  • Registered: 2010-05-21
  • Posts: 121

Re: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

And headroom is ...... ? (....still a mystery....) :-)

And why doesn't all my text show in the first post? Some of it is gone....

  • From: York, PA
  • Registered: 2010-08-27
  • Posts: 1,749

Re: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

André wrote:

And headroom is ...... ? (....still a mystery....) :-)

And why doesn't all my text show in the first post? Some of it is gone....

With a 15w amp distorting, and you turn your guitar volume down low your notes won't clean up as much as with using a 100w amp.  I think a 50 and 100 watt amp are pretty close overall, but when you get into small wattage heads you lose a lot of overall body with the tone.

  • From: Ridgeland, MS
  • Registered: 2009-08-12
  • Posts: 1,248

Re: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

The price differential is usually not too much between the two. I feel like it is well worth a little extra money for the tone and feel of a 100W amp.

  • From: Florida, USA
  • Registered: 2008-06-04
  • Posts: 1,420

Re: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

Clean headroom is the point that you crank your amp up and it doesn't reach saturation.  When a tube amp becomes totally saturated you lose "headroom" meaning there's really nowhere left to go on the clean/distortion spectrum.  100w amps naturally have more clean headroom due to their inherent loudness and power.  For example, you can crank a 100w Marshall Superlead 100 to 6-7 and it's breaking up but still pretty clean.  On a Tweed Deluxe (12 watts) you run out of headroom at 6-7 and the amp is pretty much giving you all it's got.  Very saturated and distorted...   Make more sense?  tongue

'67 and '74 Fender Twin Reverbs, '74 Marshall 1987 lead mkII, Metro Superlead 100. Pedals from TC Electronic, Ibanez, Dunlop, BK Butler, Electro-Harmonix, Fulltone, Maestro/Gibson, Loopmaster switching, VoodooLab, Boss. Gibson and Fender guitars, Dimarzio pickups.
  • Registered: 2010-05-21
  • Posts: 121

Re: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

Congratulation! You've done it! You have managed to explain it to me. Thank you:-)

  • Registered: 2010-12-30
  • Posts: 49

Re: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

I know a lot of people seem to like more wattage, but I think it depends a lot on where you play and what you're playing through it.  I have actually continually gone to lower wattage amps and mic'd them.  I'm currently running a Genz-Benz Black Pearl 30 watt, and I typically run it on 15 watts with full tubes.  It is a very versatile amp and relatively inexpensive for what you get.  There is a pentode/triode switch that I use in the triode mode, and a 2-tube or 4-tube switch that I usually run on 4-tube.  I get the full power of the tubes, but my output is much lower, and I get that nice, natural crunch a little earlier.  When I first started playing electric, I used a 50-watt tube amp and it was just too much amp for me to get the full benefit out of it.  I play mostly in small venues, so this works well for me.  If you're in a bigger setting, you might want to get the higher wattage amp.  It might be worth a trip for you to go to a store and try to play something similar before you go after a boutique amp.  Good luck!   smile

10 Reply by ken (edited by ken 2011-02-19 13:33:36)

  • ken
  • ken
  • Titanium
  • Offline
  • From: Orlando, FL
  • Registered: 2007-05-28
  • Posts: 949

Re: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

I've had both the carol ann 100 watt (older version) and now have the newer 50watt el34. I sent the 100watt to Alan and he updated it and brought it down to 50 watts. It's also set up for more useable gain throughout the volume range (so you don't have to crank it to hit the sweet spot). If your playing small clubs, you will not need more than the 50 watt model. Joe's model Carol Ann is set up to get much louder before the gain really kicks in, because Joe plays at very loud volumes and needs the clean headroom.

That said, Gary Moore and Joe have very different tones (IMO). Gary's was much more saturated, and a typical Marshall tone, where Joe's is quite a bit cleaner sounding (Dumble/Marshall mix). I'm surprised you can't get to either of those tones with the amps you have, considering the both play Marshalls. When Joe has a fly in gig, he rents two Marshall DSL100s, and he gets his signature sound without a problem.

The Carol Ann that I have OD2-50 will not get you a Gary Moore (with more gain) tone without pedals. I believe the Tucana is setup for very high gain tones, and may get you what you want.

If I wanted Gary Moore's tone, I would get the Marshall that he used...and then lock myself in a room to practice all day for 30 years.  tongue

  • Registered: 2010-05-21
  • Posts: 121

Re: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

Thank you all for your valuable feedback. I think Joe used a couple of JVM410's a few months ago, so I guess it's something wrong with me and/or my ears:-) LOL
If you have a JVM410, please drop a couple of lines describing settings and volume.

Anyway, I will be using pedals in addition to the amp's gain. For some reason I never settle with one kind of gain sound. I play a lot of different stuff, and enjoy being able to have different sounds on some songs.

There's a CAE OD 100 + for sale in my town. I have always loved that amp, so I might check it out. Completely different amp than the Carol Ann. Time will show.

  • From: N.Wales, UK
  • Registered: 2009-03-06
  • Posts: 2,183

Re: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

André wrote:

Thank you all for your valuable feedback. I think Joe used a couple of JVM410's a few months ago, so I guess it's something wrong with me and/or my ears:-) LOL
If you have a JVM410, please drop a couple of lines describing settings and volume.

Anyway, I will be using pedals in addition to the amp's gain. For some reason I never settle with one kind of gain sound. I play a lot of different stuff, and enjoy being able to have different sounds on some songs.

There's a CAE OD 100 + for sale in my town. I have always loved that amp, so I might check it out. Completely different amp than the Carol Ann. Time will show.

Where was that?
I've seen him use Vintage Modern's (Jools) and DSLs (harder to reach countries, BCC stuff)...

  • From: The Netherlands
  • Registered: 2010-02-14
  • Posts: 318

Re: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

DaveWammbarro wrote:
André wrote:

Thank you all for your valuable feedback. I think Joe used a couple of JVM410's a few months ago, so I guess it's something wrong with me and/or my ears:-) LOL
If you have a JVM410, please drop a couple of lines describing settings and volume.

Anyway, I will be using pedals in addition to the amp's gain. For some reason I never settle with one kind of gain sound. I play a lot of different stuff, and enjoy being able to have different sounds on some songs.

There's a CAE OD 100 + for sale in my town. I have always loved that amp, so I might check it out. Completely different amp than the Carol Ann. Time will show.

Where was that?
I've seen him use Vintage Modern's (Jools) and DSLs (harder to reach countries, BCC stuff)...


I believe it was North Sea Jazz 2009. I thought he was using a JCM900 in combination with a JVM410, but I'm not sure, there are some good vids on youtube of the concert though...

Rick

I don't charge for mistakes. - Joe Bonamassa
  • From: N.Wales, UK
  • Registered: 2009-03-06
  • Posts: 2,183

Re: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

Sure looks like it - the middle amp.
I learn something new everyday...
Like from Guitarist yesterday - Claptons Soldano setup was actually two JCM900 cabs with EVM12Ls...cool.

  • From: kentucky
  • Registered: 2008-03-06
  • Posts: 304

Re: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

when i read the initial question i could just hear nigel tufnel say

masque's Website

  • From: Detroit
  • Registered: 2006-06-02
  • Posts: 5,807

Re: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

My 55 watt amp through Celestion V30's distort when my map is around 5 on Master.
I had the 100 watt version of this, and I don't remember it distorting on the clean channel... I might go back. Might get rid of the V30's too in favor of some EVM 12L speakers. Just waiting and saving.

- Nic from Detroit... posting on JB's Forum since 6-2-2006
Ask me about my handwound Great Lakes Guitar Pickups
Since 2010, Bonamassa fans have taken advantage of my JB friend discount = my cost + shipping. cool
  • From: York, PA
  • Registered: 2010-08-27
  • Posts: 1,749

Re: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

NPB_EST.1979 wrote:

My 55 watt amp through Celestion V30's distort when my map is around 5 on Master.
I had the 100 watt version of this, and I don't remember it distorting on the clean channel... I might go back. Might get rid of the V30's too in favor of some EVM 12L speakers. Just waiting and saving.

Are the Black Label versions of the EV12's the same thing as the regular models?  They are soo expensive.  I wonder how good the Eminence versions are or whatever company it is that makes a similar version..

-Seth

18 Reply by ken (edited by ken 2011-02-22 10:37:39)

  • ken
  • ken
  • Titanium
  • Offline
  • From: Orlando, FL
  • Registered: 2007-05-28
  • Posts: 949

Re: Difference between 50w and 100w amp

Here's what EV says is the difference:
Take the EVM-12L, add Zakk's personal specs (improved power handling, improved magnet design, better venting, and th Black Label colors), and now you have the greatest guitar loudspeaker in the world.

Do you need a 300 watt speaker???  yikes