Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

Loud pop and billows of smoke is most likely an exploded electrolytic cap. Over voltage by mis wired volt selector?
Rick

Free download from Vienna! http://mbsy.co/bNLR
Lots of unique videos of Joe http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwd5vL8fXTw
Buy Joe's merchandise here. http://www.jbonamassa.com/affiliates/id … hp?id=1381

Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

RickB wrote:

Loud pop and billows of smoke is most likely an exploded electrolytic cap. Over voltage by mis wired volt selector?
Rick

Nik said to me that sometimes here in Australia the wall voltage can vary from 240 to 250 volts which upsets the tube bias, most likely biasing the power tubes too hot!

Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

stefanhauk wrote:
RickB wrote:

Loud pop and billows of smoke is most likely an exploded electrolytic cap. Over voltage by mis wired volt selector?
Rick

Nik said to me that sometimes here in Australia the wall voltage can vary from 240 to 250 volts which upsets the tube bias, most likely biasing the power tubes too hot!

If you pull the cover off to see the underside, a mess of paper will be what is left of the guts of an electrolytic. The culprit should be obvious. Something is exploded and/or burned. You need a tech.

Free download from Vienna! http://mbsy.co/bNLR
Lots of unique videos of Joe http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwd5vL8fXTw
Buy Joe's merchandise here. http://www.jbonamassa.com/affiliates/id … hp?id=1381

Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

RickB wrote:
stefanhauk wrote:
RickB wrote:

Loud pop and billows of smoke is most likely an exploded electrolytic cap. Over voltage by mis wired volt selector?
Rick

Nik said to me that sometimes here in Australia the wall voltage can vary from 240 to 250 volts which upsets the tube bias, most likely biasing the power tubes too hot!

If you pull the cover off to see the underside, a mess of paper will be what is left of the guts of an electrolytic. The culprit should be obvious. Something is exploded and/or burned. You need a tech.

My step dad is an electrician/bassist/avid amp-modder so if it's an obvious problem he'll be able to fix it!!

Thanks for the pointers Rick!!

Wishing you well from Australia,

- Stefan

Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

Wow, sounds. very exciting.

Still, you'll have a great story to tell once you're up and running.

conorb

Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

I hope this is a easy fix. But me thinks Rick is correct and my suggestion would be to return it to Nik for repair. I know you said your dad is able but, my best judgement would be to return the amp. That way you don't void any warranty. Good Luck and we'll all be watching this thread I'm sure.

Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

Spider wrote:

I hope this is a easy fix. But me thinks Rick is correct and my suggestion would be to return it to Nik for repair. I know you said your dad is able but, my best judgement would be to return the amp. That way you don't void any warranty. Good Luck and we'll all be watching this thread I'm sure.

Have conversed with Nik and there is no warranty issues with us opening up the amp and trying to find the fault (As Ceriatone are usually sold as kit amps so there is no real issue there), he has made some suggestions and if we are unable to fix it he will direct us to his most local service centre. Nik is a very understanding guy and is doing his best to help.

Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

I'm with Rick and Spider. Over-biased tubes don't pop and they sure don't billow smoke.

Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

wharris wrote:

I'm with Rick and Spider. Over-biased tubes don't pop and they sure don't billow smoke.

Yes but the heat transferred may have fried a few caps and resistors, purely Nik's suggestion, he knows these amps like the back of his hand.

Here is one of Nik's emails:


If anything you guys are not sure, do ask me first.

Also, this is Oz? You might want to check your wall.

Usually, when this happens to a new amp, the wall in OZ is sometimes at 250V
instead of 240V. We have had this happening (dead tubes)

A 250V into 240V amp means abt 5% diff.

So B+ voltage of abt 470 could easily go 490V, which is enough to cause bias
to be real hot.

For cathode biased amps (like an 18W) or AC30, where the EL84s are already
ran very hot, the tubes will definitely fail very shortly.

But in any case, perhaps indeed something is not right. If you can get your
step dad to open it and take a look (esp power section ie the PS board and
the power tubes area), that'd be good

Send me some pics as well, so I can check too.

Don't worry, this will be covered should there be any need.

Also, when you saw smoke, did the tone of the amp change?

Things to remember:

1) Do not run the amp with just 2 power tubes

2) If you want to change to 1/2 power, best to do it while amp on standby.

3) Other than the usual speaker impedance thing. But , to be safe, check
what your cabinet is, impedance wise.

You can easily do this by measuring across the tip and sleeve, for
resistance.

Although it is rare, a cab could be miswired, or have 1 speaker affected,
causing impedance to be wrong.


Hope this helps, do let me know..

Thanks!

nik

28 (edited by RickB 2012-09-12 06:23:46)

Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

Did it play a bit before blowing or was it at the first power up within a minute? Any loose hardware rattling around inside?
Good to hear Nik is standing behind the product. My kind of manufacturer!
Best of luck on a speedy repair. Sometimes new baby blues is what you get no matter how good they make them due to random component failures. A few of my top end lines now do a two day stressed burn in to reduce this kind of occurrence to nil, but that is not feasible for small manufacturers.
Rick

Free download from Vienna! http://mbsy.co/bNLR
Lots of unique videos of Joe http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwd5vL8fXTw
Buy Joe's merchandise here. http://www.jbonamassa.com/affiliates/id … hp?id=1381

Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

I played it for about 45 minutes!

After opening her up two the writing on two of the power tubes have blackened. His predictions of a tube issue may be correct.

Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

stefanhauk wrote:

I played it for about 45 minutes!

After opening her up two the writing on two of the power tubes have blackened. His predictions of a tube issue may be correct.

Then it was most likely bias heat with adjacent components overheated and damaged, or a shorted tube. That pop and smoke really sound like a shorted cap. Resistors just smoke, caps make that pop.

Free download from Vienna! http://mbsy.co/bNLR
Lots of unique videos of Joe http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwd5vL8fXTw
Buy Joe's merchandise here. http://www.jbonamassa.com/affiliates/id … hp?id=1381

Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

I had a resistor smoke on me. that smell doesn't come out for weeks either!
It is smart to bias a tube amp before you play it... especially if it's coming from another country.

- Nic from Detroit... posting on JB's Forum since 6-2-2006
Ask me about my handwound Great Lakes Guitar Pickups
Since 2010, Bonamassa fans have taken advantage of my JB friend discount = my cost + shipping. cool

Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

Yep

definately sounds like the tubes have been damaged, I remember when I first turned on my ceriatone after building it ,one of the tubes was glowing with like purple lighting in the tube but the amp
worked ok .

then every so often it would pop the 500ma fuse, I bought a new set of tubes and have no further issues .

but you need to check first if anything else has been damaged .

but leave it to your Dad to poke around as these amps can be dangerous even unplugged.

"Everybody's entitled to my opinion. wink

Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

SOFTMC wrote:

Yep

definately sounds like the tubes have been damaged, I remember when I first turned on my ceriatone after building it ,one of the tubes was glowing with like purple lighting in the tube but the amp
worked ok .

then every so often it would pop the 500ma fuse, I bought a new set of tubes and have no further issues .

but you need to check first if anything else has been damaged .

but leave it to your Dad to poke around as these amps can be dangerous even unplugged.

A purple glow is a gassy tube. Lost the vacuum and the glow is ionized air.

Free download from Vienna! http://mbsy.co/bNLR
Lots of unique videos of Joe http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwd5vL8fXTw
Buy Joe's merchandise here. http://www.jbonamassa.com/affiliates/id … hp?id=1381

Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

does the Silver Jub Ceriatone have a footswitch for gain?
I like how you can switch it from 100/50w smile

- Nic from Detroit... posting on JB's Forum since 6-2-2006
Ask me about my handwound Great Lakes Guitar Pickups
Since 2010, Bonamassa fans have taken advantage of my JB friend discount = my cost + shipping. cool

Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

Yikes - Sorry to hear Stefan.  I've been away for a few days, and just catching up on the news now.

I remember my old Electronics 101 lecturer telling us that all electronic components have a magic puff of smoke inserted in them at the point of manufacture.  If that magic smoke ever escapes OUT of them, then they stop working... lol

JBLP Gold Top #129 - redubbed "#1 in Oz"

Re: New Amp Day Ceriatone Silver Joe-bilee

stefanhauk wrote:
Spider wrote:

I hope this is a easy fix. But me thinks Rick is correct and my suggestion would be to return it to Nik for repair. I know you said your dad is able but, my best judgement would be to return the amp. That way you don't void any warranty. Good Luck and we'll all be watching this thread I'm sure.

Have conversed with Nik and there is no warranty issues with us opening up the amp and trying to find the fault (As Ceriatone are usually sold as kit amps so there is no real issue there), he has made some suggestions and if we are unable to fix it he will direct us to his most local service centre. Nik is a very understanding guy and is doing his best to help.

I understand. I have had many emails with Nik about a possible purchase, and he is indeed courteous and very helpful. He replied promptly to each and every email and addressed my concerns. However, if I had purchased a new amp, that I had only used for a few moments before it basically blew up, it would be repacked and returned as soon as it cooled off. Call me crazy but I'm not repairing a brand new amp, unless of course I was the builder. :>)