• From: Wheeling, IL
  • Registered: 2006-12-07
  • Posts: 618

Topic: How does this happen???

I happened to be up late last night and caught the Conan O'Brien show. And had the misfortune to watch the most god-awful band I've seen in quite a while. Name: Dinosaur Jr. M.O.: loud "rock" "music" and a singer who couldn't sing in tune if his life depended on it.

How in the name of all that's good and holy can a band this bad get a major record label contract AND get a featured spot on Conan O'Brien?? And a musician as stellar as Joe doesn't even get the time of day? Yeah, yeah, I know this has been discussed a million different times but I just had to voice my frustration after seeing that abortion of a "rock band" last night.

No need to answer. It's all strictly rhetorical anyway. I have my memories of Rockford....

I'm just saying.
  • Registered: 2006-04-21
  • Posts: 729

Re: How does this happen???

I think the booking people for the show want to keep the labels happy.  If they push it, it gets on the show.  My cynical thought is that the whole music industry is just about signing a product (band), putting lipstick on the pig (lowest common denominator marketing and packaging), and using payola and influence to get radio play and TV appearances to push the (many times) crap. 

It's just suits pushing crap and telling people what they should want, like detergent or toys for kids.  So many consumers will buy anything that has a slick ad/music video whether it's crap or not.

  • From: Washington State
  • Registered: 2006-03-30
  • Posts: 1,593

Re: How does this happen???

Nancy in Chicago wrote:

...How in the name of all that's good and holy can a band this bad get a major record label contract AND get a featured spot on Conan O'Brien??...

No doubt the first question answers the second one - the major record label got them on Conan's show. Don't forget though, Joe's already had a major label deal with Epic and opted out - to retain creative control of his own product (and ultimately a larger percentage of his own earnings).

Rest assured Joe will still be selling out shows long after Jr. Dinosaur falls off the map!

  • bogie
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Re: How does this happen???

Dinosaur JR also was a huge part of the early to mid 80's punk movement, kind of an underground thing. They influenced a lot of bands and have legendary status in that genre. I saw it too and was disappointed, but it never really was my thing. They are in that realm of Sonic Youth and  Husker Du and it never was huge mainstream, but again always had a huge cult following. They were kind of the forerunners of indie music. They did it themselves, NO major labels, just went out and played. I gotta give up to them for that because, well, that's what we're doing, but again, the music wasn't for me.

Bogie

  • Registered: 2006-04-25
  • Posts: 128

Re: How does this happen???

Amen to that Stu.  Joe is like a shiny gold nuggett sitting in a pile of turds.  The gold simply can't be ignored for  very long and it will continue to shine long after the turds are flushed away.


--------------- Like they say at PADI, Plan your dive & dive your plan-----------------

Joe can wake up with a smile on his face everyday and play his heart out like he does, cause he is beating the odds, & topping the charts.  I think even Joe can see how far he has progressed, though apparently he chose not take the easy way out. (there's the gold)  He is a very hard worker with the number of shows he put on every year.

His street team, whoever started this wheel in motion, apparently had a brilliant marketing idea, cause it's a great plan & it's working.

kat

  • Registered: 2006-04-25
  • Posts: 40

Re: How does this happen???

I've noticed that while a lot of talk shows feature easy-on-the-ears  mainstream music, Conan always has an interesting mix of really awesome up-and-coming bands, as well as a bunch of really AWFUL bands. His show is hysterical yet slightly offbeat, and he seems to show bands that a lot of other shows won't, taking risks, and sometimes showing bands that a lot of people may not like.

While I also believe that there are business politics and record label negotiations going on that determine who gets to be on TV, I do give Conan's show props for taking risks when it comes to showing bands on TV that a lot of other shows wouldn't touch.

  • From: Harrison, Arkansas
  • Registered: 2006-04-21
  • Posts: 3,155

Re: How does this happen???

bogie wrote:

Dinosaur JR also was a huge part of the early to mid 80's punk movement, kind of an underground thing. They influenced a lot of bands and have legendary status in that genre. I saw it too and was disappointed, but it never really was my thing. They are in that realm of Sonic Youth and  Husker Du and it never was huge mainstream, but again always had a huge cult following. They were kind of the forerunners of indie music. They did it themselves, NO major labels, just went out and played. I gotta give up to them for that because, well, that's what we're doing, but again, the music wasn't for me.

Bogie

My thoughts exactly.

"And in the end, the love you take is equal to the love you make"

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8 Reply by gsj (edited by gsj 2007-09-07 16:52:01)

  • gsj
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  • From: North Essex, England
  • Registered: 2006-09-21
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Re: How does this happen???

'Supply and demand'....or £££££$$$$$ placed in the right pocket.....? smile

never give up, never slow down
never grow old, never ever die young

9 Reply by Rocket (edited by Rocket 2007-09-07 18:19:37)

  • Rocket
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Re: How does this happen???

I didn't know Dinosaur, Jr. had a major label deal now?  They are old and crusty now too! They rode the D.I.Y. wave many years, then I thought Warner had them mid-career, and then they faded back to indies?  So are they promoting a new release? Max Weinberg has influence on the musical guest choice of Conan, so maybe things just "happened".  The band has had far and few between things I really get into (although the Neil Young "Rust Never Sleeps" era they & others had more of an open door to my ears), having been more into things likeThe Cult way back then as far as "cult" bands went (and I wasn't following ANY trends in the '80s lol), but all these independently slanted bands influenced even Nirvana and Metallica, etc. whether they or their fans want to admit it.  I sense a much stronger "label" influence for The Tonight Show & Saturday Night Live musical guests than the other late-night shows...
Rock On & Keep the Faith,
Rocket

bogie wrote:

Dinosaur JR also was a huge part of the early to mid 80's punk movement, kind of an underground thing. They influenced a lot of bands and have legendary status in that genre. I saw it too and was disappointed, but it never really was my thing. They are in that realm of Sonic Youth and  Husker Du and it never was huge mainstream, but again always had a huge cult following. They were kind of the forerunners of indie music. They did it themselves, NO major labels, just went out and played. I gotta give up to them for that because, well, that's what we're doing, but again, the music wasn't for me.

Bogie

"He still doesn't charge for mistakes! wink"
http://jbonamassa.com/tour-dates/
"Everybody wants ta get inta the act!"
“Now, this isn’t your ordinary party crowd, here.  I mean, there are professionals in here.”
  • From: Wheeling, IL
  • Registered: 2006-12-07
  • Posts: 618

Re: How does this happen???

Thanks to Bogie and all for the info on this band. I never would have figured they'd been around that long. I guess going the indie route does have advantages. Great performers like Joe don't have to sell their souls and bad bands like Dinosaur Jr. don't have to fade away.

I know Conan often has non-mainstream bands but these guys were so bad I was blown away by the sheer awfulness of it. And they've had a following for 20 years? I guess there's no accounting for taste. smile

I'm just saying.

11 Reply by Rocket (edited by Rocket 2007-09-09 01:31:17)

  • Rocket
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Re: How does this happen???

Yeah, well I watched last night and on Letterman there were the Arctic Monkeys, owners of the all kinds of awards and records for UK....but they bit the big one-all I could think of was why did I actually work for a living...No offense to any fans, maybe that wasn't representative of them overall, but my word I can play & sing better than that with the flu even.  Someone on Amazon said Joe and Sloe Gin sounded contrived, well I thnk I found a better example....my opinions only!  I guess there ISN'T any accounting for taste! hmm

Rock On & Keep the Faith,
Rocket

Nancy in Chicago wrote:

Thanks to Bogie and all for the info on this band. I never would have figured they'd been around that long. I guess going the indie route does have advantages. Great performers like Joe don't have to sell their souls and bad bands like Dinosaur Jr. don't have to fade away.

I know Conan often has non-mainstream bands but these guys were so bad I was blown away by the sheer awfulness of it. And they've had a following for 20 years? I guess there's no accounting for taste. smile

"He still doesn't charge for mistakes! wink"
http://jbonamassa.com/tour-dates/
"Everybody wants ta get inta the act!"
“Now, this isn’t your ordinary party crowd, here.  I mean, there are professionals in here.”
  • jim m
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  • From: Okie City, OK
  • Registered: 2006-04-24
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Re: How does this happen???

Rocket wrote:

Yeah well I watched last night and on Letterman there was the Arctic Monkeys, owners of the all kinds of awards and records for UK....but they bit the big one-all I could think of was why did I actually work for a living...No offense to any fans, maybe that wasn't representative of them overall, but my word I can play & sing better than that with the flu even.  SOmeone on amazon said Joe and Sloe Gin sounded contrived, well I thnk I found a beter example....my opinions only!  I guess threr ISN'T any accounting for taste! hmm

Rock On & Keep the Faith,
Rocket

Nancy in Chicago wrote:

Thanks to Bogie and all for the info on this band. I never would have figured they'd been around that long. I guess going the indie route does have advantages. Great performers like Joe don't have to sell their souls and bad bands like Dinosaur Jr. don't have to fade away.

I know Conan often has non-mainstream bands but these guys were so bad I was blown away by the sheer awfulness of it. And they've had a following for 20 years? I guess there's no accounting for taste. smile

I second that emotion. Even though I havn't heard you sing Rockt I'm pretty sure a trained monkey much less an arctic one could play and sing as well. I thought of this thread while watching before I couldn't take it anymore.

jim m's Website

  • Dino
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Re: How does this happen???

Dinosaur Jr does not have a major label deal.  They are on Fat Possum.

Do you realize that management has a larger impact on appearances on the big three shows?  For example, Dinosaur Jr is on a small boutique label, but they have enough resources that management and the label combined can make a real push to the tv shows.

If you look at Joe objectively...he is with William Morris...the largest most powerful agency in the world...they represent everyone for everything.  Thousands of agents, hundreds of millions of dollars.

I ask this, objectively why has Joe not been on these programs?  Bill Perry, Lil Ed both played Conan.  My friend Henry played Leno, Letterman, and Conan.

I question the desire of the great er orginization.  I understand we all want to see Joe play on the SuperBowl halftime show...but these are things that Joe is objectively in a place to do.

As far as Dinosaur Jr...J mAscis is one of the greater guitar players of the last 20 years.  His virtuosity for a style of music that you do not appreciate makes it no less amazing.

Dinosaur Jr came out of the Amherst scene that created The Lemonheads, Juliana Hatfield, Tanya Donnely, Belly, Frank Black, the Pixies, and Kim Deal and the Breeders.  This was a great era of music, that united the forces of the beatles, and that amazing pop sensibility, and an awesome amount of feedback and punk rock energy.

J...in my opinion has the same sort of mastery of feedback and Neil Young.

14 Reply by Rocket (edited by Rocket 2007-09-08 20:49:18)

  • Rocket
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Re: How does this happen???

Huh? I don't want to see Joe play the Super Bowl halftime...I don't watch those, nor place any value on performance or performers there.  I think we had a discussion about last year or the year before where I got sucked in for a few seconds, frankly I can't remember who it was even.  I think the reason Joe is not on the TV shows is management and Joe both do not desire to be.  There is very little to be gained from these appearances, at least in my opinion, Super Bowl notwithstanding, but does that really fit the image at this stage? No.  You must have the broad appeal & recognition that Mr. Joe Bonamassa does not have,  qualified by "SO FAR"...As far as Amherst and that whole sector of the Northeast (to include or exclude Boston or other major cities) is one of the ripest, most musically diverse areas I have ever found.

Dino wrote:

Dinosaur Jr does not have a major label deal.  They are on Fat Possum.

Do you realize that management has a larger impact on appearances on the big three shows?  For example, Dinosaur Jr is on a small boutique label, but they have enough resources that management and the label combined can make a real push to the tv shows.

If you look at Joe objectively...he is with William Morris...the largest most powerful agency in the world...they represent everyone for everything.  Thousands of agents, hundreds of millions of dollars.

I ask this, objectively why has Joe not been on these programs?  Bill Perry, Lil Ed both played Conan.  My friend Henry played Leno, Letterman, and Conan.

I question the desire of the great er orginization.  I understand we all want to see Joe play on the SuperBowl halftime show...but these are things that Joe is objectively in a place to do.

As far as Dinosaur Jr...J mAscis is one of the greater guitar players of the last 20 years.  His virtuosity for a style of music that you do not appreciate makes it no less amazing.

Dinosaur Jr came out of the Amherst scene that created The Lemonheads, Juliana Hatfield, Tanya Donnely, Belly, Frank Black, the Pixies, and Kim Deal and the Breeders.  This was a great era of music, that united the forces of the beatles, and that amazing pop sensibility, and an awesome amount of feedback and punk rock energy.

J...in my opinion has the same sort of mastery of feedback and Neil Young.

"He still doesn't charge for mistakes! wink"
http://jbonamassa.com/tour-dates/
"Everybody wants ta get inta the act!"
“Now, this isn’t your ordinary party crowd, here.  I mean, there are professionals in here.”
  • From: Benicia, Ca.
  • Registered: 2006-05-08
  • Posts: 5,828

Re: How does this happen???

Nancy you struck a nerve with me on this subject. I watch Letterman and Conan on a pretty regular basis and I usually click off more times than not when these train wrecks they call music acts start playing. Other than the mainstream acts they occasionally book I think the people who line up the talent, and I use that term loosely, take themselves too seriously as in terminally too hip that they have to book the most bizarre acts to make themselves appear to be cutting edge. It's a rare occasion when I catch something that falls under the heading: quality. A couple instances were, many years ago I caught Bill Withers on Johnny Carson before anybody had heard of him, and the same with Robert Randolph on Letterman some years ago. As I said most of it is too harsh to sit all the way through.

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16 Reply by Rocket (edited by Rocket 2007-09-09 01:41:28)

  • Rocket
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Re: How does this happen???

That's weird I was thinking of this thread too and couldn't take it anymore either.  A "different" tuning on a guitar / bass is one thing, but their's weren't in tune and it wasn't an alternative tuning, it was just out of tune period.  The question is why???, whether on purpose or not on purpose! Yuck-o!

jim m wrote:
Rocket wrote:

Yeah well I watched last night and on Letterman there was the Arctic Monkeys, owners of the all kinds of awards and records for UK....but they bit the big one-all I could think of was why did I actually work for a living...No offense to any fans, maybe that wasn't representative of them overall, but my word I can play & sing better than that with the flu even.  SOmeone on amazon said Joe and Sloe Gin sounded contrived, well I thnk I found a beter example....my opinions only!  I guess threr ISN'T any accounting for taste! hmm

Rock On & Keep the Faith,
Rocket

Nancy in Chicago wrote:

Thanks to Bogie and all for the info on this band. I never would have figured they'd been around that long. I guess going the indie route does have advantages. Great performers like Joe don't have to sell their souls and bad bands like Dinosaur Jr. don't have to fade away.

I know Conan often has non-mainstream bands but these guys were so bad I was blown away by the sheer awfulness of it. And they've had a following for 20 years? I guess there's no accounting for taste. smile

I second that emotion. Even though I havn't heard you sing Rockt I'm pretty sure a trained monkey much less an arctic one could play and sing as well. I thought of this thread while watching before I couldn't take it anymore.

"He still doesn't charge for mistakes! wink"
http://jbonamassa.com/tour-dates/
"Everybody wants ta get inta the act!"
“Now, this isn’t your ordinary party crowd, here.  I mean, there are professionals in here.”
  • From: Gnashville, TN
  • Registered: 2007-02-14
  • Posts: 198

Re: How does this happen???

It's not just Conan and shows like his.  Has anyone watched Austin City Limits lately?

geez louise....some of these band are just barre chord playing monkeys. It seems lately that if you come up with an offbeat name like My Morning Jacket, Deathcab For Cutie or Modest Mouse you can get on tv. I like all kinds of music but you at least have to tune your guitar and know how to get near a pitch vocally.  On the bright side TIVO makes it much easier and faster to get through the shows.

"why isn't the number "11" pronounced "onety one"???....S. Wright.

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