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Joe Bonamassa Forum → Joe's Guitars, Amps and Gear → Perhaps the best Dumble tone? (my .02)
Am i the only person in the world who doen't particularly like the Dumble tone.
*hand up*
Am i the only person in the world who doen't particularly like the Dumble tone.
Likely not.
That said- how many have you heard? No doubt the Dumbles have there detractors and with good reason. Dumbles and TrainWrecks garner much drama on the forums.
There are around 6 major Dumble variants (circuits) and of those there are myriad different setups-
I happen to love certain circuits that are essentially staged/shared gain circuits based on some key ingredients.
You may not like this (Below) tone- but I think this tone is not what most think or hear in their head when they think Dumble . This is a Clone circuit based on a particular 90s era Dumble , El34 HRM circuit (#183 to be exact) but with a special Marshall Transformer set up. A friend of mine built this for me.
Don't pay attention to the playing but the tone that this thing gets. Pardon the foul language but I was caught off guard at how this thing sounded. This is right out of the box, No loop or effects of any kind. Just a JB Les Paul straight in to the Head with a 2X12 cab with Eminence Delta Pros (Eminence version of EVM12L)
Again- perhaps not your cup of tea which is totally cool- but I thought this was a pretty sick tone and not at all like "typical" dumble tone....if there is such thing.
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_so … ID=9793799
On that note- It's understandable that Joe or anyone else who have a fairly defined D tone to think Peter's amp was a Fugazi. It was at low volume and set for a particularly thin tone so as not to swamp the mic on the recorder so the sound was pretty meek.
The Gear Page dudes can get really cukoo over stuff. I got roasted by a dude who went mental when I suggested that his recommended amp builder might just be human and not capable of "building anything you want".
Cool-
Now this sounds awesome. I think the D tone is overrated but only because idiots wait 10 years for one to show up and then - oh wait, I still sound like me....crap...there must be a King of Tone pedal I can wait 2 more years for. If someone practiced solid for 10 years straight you could make a Peavy sound like a Dumble. ALL gear is overated - PRACTICE is not.
That being said, I am a gearhead myself because I love everything associated with guitars and guitar playing. The tone in this clip for the 100w HRM absolutely wipes it's butt with the Fugazi or whatever you call it. But I think it's the player too, as I love the chops and touch in this one and not a big fan of the other one.
I also, for one, stay away from the (to quote Gearmandude) "High Priests" of TGP. I love this forum - TGP blows. Just MHO.
jimmydweed wrote:Am i the only person in the world who doen't particularly like the Dumble tone.
Likely not.
That said- how many have you heard? No doubt the Dumbles have there detractors and with good reason. Dumbles and TrainWrecks garner much drama on the forums.
There are around 6 major Dumble variants (circuits) and of those there are myriad different setups-
I happen to love certain circuits that are essentially staged/shared gain circuits based on some key ingredients.
You may not like this (Below) tone- but I think this tone is not what most think or hear in their head when they think Dumble . This is a Clone circuit based on a particular 90s era Dumble , El34 HRM circuit (#183 to be exact) but with a special Marshall Transformer set up. A friend of mine built this for me.
Don't pay attention to the playing but the tone that this thing gets. Pardon the foul language but I was caught off guard at how this thing sounded. This is right out of the box, No loop or effects of any kind. Just a JB Les Paul straight in to the Head with a 2X12 cab with Eminence Delta Pros (Eminence version of EVM12L)
Again- perhaps not your cup of tea which is totally cool- but I thought this was a pretty sick tone and not at all like "typical" dumble tone....if there is such thing.
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_so … ID=9793799
On that note- It's understandable that Joe or anyone else who have a fairly defined D tone to think Peter's amp was a Fugazi. It was at low volume and set for a particularly thin tone so as not to swamp the mic on the recorder so the sound was pretty meek.
The Gear Page dudes can get really cukoo over stuff. I got roasted by a dude who went mental when I suggested that his recommended amp builder might just be human and not capable of "building anything you want".
Cool-
Joe,
I have read all the garbage being posted at another site, and quite honestly, I can't believe the
personal attacks on your character, playing ability, and style.
What a bunch of GARBAGE. I'm sorry, but you presented an opinion, based on the facts as
you interpreted them, and Holy Cow! it's like the freaking JB Haters came out of everywhere.
Lord!! What the heck is the problem???
I thought we still lived in a democracy where free speech, was one OUR inherited rights as
Americans. You gave an opinion on an amp....BFD. Oh I forgot.. it was a ......drum roll please..
Dum***.
You would thought that it was a full moon they way they all went batty.
Unlike most of the people who commented about you and your playing etc...
I've met you, and you were gracious, and more than kind enough, to share your time with a
very grateful fan.
MOST pro Musicians out there, don't give that access to their fans...let alone the photo's ops
and videos that you freely allow of you and your performances.
Besides being an exceptionally gifted and hardworking musician, I found you to be a really
kind and humble individual, willing to give freely of your time, and expertise. You gave me a tip on
an effect I asked you about at that time (Way Huge Pork Loin) and signed my LP to boot. Then put
on an OUTSTANDING show.
Joe, you're Aces in my book, and I'm sure in many other people's / fans views well...
I think there's a lot of jealousy out there, because you work hard, and you're fans truly appreciate
you, and your bands, and your playing abilities.
That's too bad for the neigh-sayers.
You keep doing what your doing...I'll keep coming to see you, and your bands,
and buying your records.
Thanks Joe, for all you do, and all the music play. You've re-energized my playing..and for that...
I'm truly grateful.
Cheers
+1'000'000etc
Well said!
Joe,
I have read all the garbage being posted at another site, and quite honestly, I can't believe the
personal attacks on your character, playing ability, and style.
What a bunch of GARBAGE. I'm sorry, but you presented an opinion, based on the facts as
you interpreted them, and Holy Cow! it's like the freaking JB Haters came out of everywhere.
Lord!! What the heck is the problem???
I thought we still lived in a democracy where free speech, was one OUR inherited rights as
Americans. You gave an opinion on an amp....BFD. Oh I forgot.. it was a ......drum roll please..
Dum***.
You would though that it was a full moon they way they all went batty.
Unlike most of the people who commented about you and your playing etc...
I've met you, and you were gracious, and more than kind enough, to share your time with a
very grateful fan.
MOST pro Musicians out there, don't give that access to their fans...let alone the photo's ops
and videos that you freely allow of you and your performances.
Besides being an exceptionally gifted and hardworking musician, I found you to be a really
kind and humble individual, willing to give freely of your time, and expertise. You gave me a tip on
an effect I asked you about at that time (Way Huge Pork Loin) and signed my LP to boot. Then put
on an OUTSTANDING show.
Joe, you're Aces in my book, and I'm sure in many other people's / fans views well...
I think there's a lot of jealousy out there, because you work hard, and you're fans truly appreciate
you, and your bands, and your playing abilities.
That's too bad for the neigh-sayers.
You keep doing what your doing...I'll keep coming to see you, and your bands,
and buying your records.
Thanks Joe, for all you do, and all the music play. You've re-energized my playing..and for that...
I'm truly grateful.
Cheers
Perfectly stated Aussiemeats. To hell with them. Joe's got more talent than that lot in a pile.
+1'000'000etc
Well said!
aussiemeats wrote:Joe,
I have read all the garbage being posted at another site, and quite honestly, I can't believe the
personal attacks on your character, playing ability, and style.
What a bunch of GARBAGE. I'm sorry, but you presented an opinion, based on the facts as
you interpreted them, and Holy Cow! it's like the freaking JB Haters came out of everywhere.
Lord!! What the heck is the problem???
I thought we still lived in a democracy where free speech, was one OUR inherited rights as
Americans. You gave an opinion on an amp....BFD. Oh I forgot.. it was a ......drum roll please..
Dum***.
You would though that it was a full moon they way they all went batty.
Unlike most of the people who commented about you and your playing etc...
I've met you, and you were gracious, and more than kind enough, to share your time with a
very grateful fan.
MOST pro Musicians out there, don't give that access to their fans...let alone the photo's ops
and videos that you freely allow of you and your performances.
Besides being an exceptionally gifted and hardworking musician, I found you to be a really
kind and humble individual, willing to give freely of your time, and expertise. You gave me a tip on
an effect I asked you about at that time (Way Huge Pork Loin) and signed my LP to boot. Then put
on an OUTSTANDING show.
Joe, you're Aces in my book, and I'm sure in many other people's / fans views well...
I think there's a lot of jealousy out there, because you work hard, and you're fans truly appreciate
you, and your bands, and your playing abilities.
That's too bad for the neigh-sayers.
You keep doing what your doing...I'll keep coming to see you, and your bands,
and buying your records.
Thanks Joe, for all you do, and all the music play. You've re-energized my playing..and for that...
I'm truly grateful.
Cheers
The 'hair growth products' comment was below the belt...but these people thrive on a reaction - there is a specific type of person who has grown and bred like a parasite...they do nothing good. I can only imagine what they have missing or wrong in their lives to sit there and mull like some aged, embittered actor on the soap opera of the internet.
The 'hair growth products' comment was below the belt...but these people thrive on a reaction - there is a specific type of person who has grown and bred like a parasite...they do nothing good. I can only imagine what they have missing or wrong in their lives to sit there and mull like some aged, embittered actor on the soap opera of the internet.
Yeah I was on that thread defending the cause ready to take any of them on.....I can take people criticizing my amps or Joes playing, but when it gets personal, thats BS.
Let me state this, it is very very difficult for a known player or a known guitar or amp builder to post on somewhere like the gear page without getting attacked, misquoted or dickheads trying to argue for the sake of nothing more than trying to get one over.
I had a hard time with TGP for several years, I took a lot of crap, but for whatever reason now no-ones really argues with me. I followed the lead of David Torn and just answered intelligently and ignored the idiots. It worked.
There has been a Carol-Ann Roll call thread n TGP now for 2 or 3 years with 1000's upon 1000's of posts on it. Completely full of friendly people. I answer questions on there on a daily basis and keep it in order and it has helped spread the word really well to not only the people who post but the many 1000's who just read. I can say that in that thread there are many fans of Joe and his work.
So the key with TGP is to ignore any thread that has the word 'Dumble' in it........
In fairness TGP is run by some pretty decent guys who do their best to keep it in order.
And for the record...that Dumble DID sound like bollocks to me too...I totally agree with Joes statement and said so on that thread !!
I'll also say that I'd have to pay $20k+ to Hair Club USA to have as much hair as Joe does !!
jimmydweed wrote:Am i the only person in the world who doen't particularly like the Dumble tone.
Likely not.
That said- how many have you heard? No doubt the Dumbles have there detractors and with good reason. Dumbles and TrainWrecks garner much drama on the forums.
There are around 6 major Dumble variants (circuits) and of those there are myriad different setups-
I happen to love certain circuits that are essentially staged/shared gain circuits based on some key ingredients.
You may not like this (Below) tone- but I think this tone is not what most think or hear in their head when they think Dumble . This is a Clone circuit based on a particular 90s era Dumble , El34 HRM circuit (#183 to be exact) but with a special Marshall Transformer set up. A friend of mine built this for me.
Don't pay attention to the playing but the tone that this thing gets. Pardon the foul language but I was caught off guard at how this thing sounded. This is right out of the box, No loop or effects of any kind. Just a JB Les Paul straight in to the Head with a 2X12 cab with Eminence Delta Pros (Eminence version of EVM12L)
Again- perhaps not your cup of tea which is totally cool- but I thought this was a pretty sick tone and not at all like "typical" dumble tone....if there is such thing.
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_so … ID=9793799
On that note- It's understandable that Joe or anyone else who have a fairly defined D tone to think Peter's amp was a Fugazi. It was at low volume and set for a particularly thin tone so as not to swamp the mic on the recorder so the sound was pretty meek.
The Gear Page dudes can get really cukoo over stuff. I got roasted by a dude who went mental when I suggested that his recommended amp builder might just be human and not capable of "building anything you want".
Cool-
Just for the record the CA JB-100 used for the second solo of 'Stop' is a n EL34 100W amp that has similar gain staging to an HRM Dumble. I would say Joes very very familiar with all Dumble varieties and derivatives.
The only criticism I have for your amps is that I don't have one.....yet! 
Billion81 wrote:jimmydweed wrote:Am i the only person in the world who doen't particularly like the Dumble tone.
Likely not.
That said- how many have you heard? No doubt the Dumbles have there detractors and with good reason. Dumbles and TrainWrecks garner much drama on the forums.
There are around 6 major Dumble variants (circuits) and of those there are myriad different setups-
I happen to love certain circuits that are essentially staged/shared gain circuits based on some key ingredients.
You may not like this (Below) tone- but I think this tone is not what most think or hear in their head when they think Dumble . This is a Clone circuit based on a particular 90s era Dumble , El34 HRM circuit (#183 to be exact) but with a special Marshall Transformer set up. A friend of mine built this for me.
Don't pay attention to the playing but the tone that this thing gets. Pardon the foul language but I was caught off guard at how this thing sounded. This is right out of the box, No loop or effects of any kind. Just a JB Les Paul straight in to the Head with a 2X12 cab with Eminence Delta Pros (Eminence version of EVM12L)
Again- perhaps not your cup of tea which is totally cool- but I thought this was a pretty sick tone and not at all like "typical" dumble tone....if there is such thing.
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_so … ID=9793799
On that note- It's understandable that Joe or anyone else who have a fairly defined D tone to think Peter's amp was a Fugazi. It was at low volume and set for a particularly thin tone so as not to swamp the mic on the recorder so the sound was pretty meek.
The Gear Page dudes can get really cukoo over stuff. I got roasted by a dude who went mental when I suggested that his recommended amp builder might just be human and not capable of "building anything you want".
Cool-
Just for the record the CA JB-100 used for the second solo of 'Stop' is a n EL34 100W amp that has similar gain staging to an HRM Dumble. I would say Joes very very familiar with all Dumble varieties and derivatives.
No doubt Alan- that semi remedial didactic was to a poster on the thread and certainly not to Joe. I know he knows his stuff.
Interesting tid-bit on the 'Stop' CA JB-100 as the fact that he is using a EL34 based CA gets little press as he seems to mostly use the 6l6 variant which I also think is killer. I think the CA amps are brilliant and had a trade for a OD2 for my BlackPlate but the dude took a sale instead.
Still hoping.
I do find it a bit funny that the folks on here were sort of dismissive the D tone yet praise Joe's tone which is heavily flavored by 1/2 his amp rig D type circuits. Clearly the Van Weelden is a straight ODS clone vs. the CA JB100 which has a few D "traits"
It's all the same to me. I don't get twisted up if some loves or hates this or that player or amp or whatever.. You can't take this **## with you folks...
Anyway- My preference would be for a OD2, 100 watt EL34 with a Low Gain set up vs. the Tucana or Revo though Fusionbear's amps are pretty killer with those Scumnicos.
Well Im going to go ahead and wade in here....
People judging an entire forum by a few responses are really being short sighted.
TGP has one of the largest memberships of the guitar gear discussion sites. Like anything, the bigger it gets, the harder it is to control. People will express their opinions, and especially when they think they have relative anonymity they tend to not remember the golden rule.
ON the other hand, for every PIA member that just looks for reasons to be haters, there's 5 members that are helpful, interested in genuine discussion and are there to be part of the community. Things get taken to personally. Of course, when people come in defending (meaning well of course) it's akin to yelling 'Fire' in a crowded room, and genuine discussion disolves into a pissing match. Something to think about.
Joe you expressed an opinion on your forum, which is your right. You actually play and live the dream most of us wish we could. Don't take the jealousy personally. You had as many defenders (if not more..including this Moderator) as you did detractors. When I met you a few years ago, John Mayer was the 'hatee' of the day. At least they're moving several rungs up the musicianship slot.
BTW Thanks again for your time and courtesy when I met you in Sonora right after Sloe Gin came out. Still a highlight for me.
That's me on the far left, with the WCR Pickups Family.
http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m141 … Bplus4.jpg
Now for my opinion on the Dumble tone in question. It's okay. Not earth shattering, but D tones don't work for my playing.
A Cathode biased EL34 amp, and a Marshall Jubilee do just fine.
Take care,
Mike Petrich
Big Mike
Moderator TGP
There's quite a stir on The Gear Page over this. Anytime you mention Dumble the gloves come off and the Rumble begins. If only TAG would be allowed back in The Gear Page...I like hanging out in the Carol Ann thread where it's more mellow!
Well Im going to go ahead and wade in here....
People judging an entire forum by a few responses are really being short sighted.
TGP has one of the largest memberships of the guitar gear discussion sites. Like anything, the bigger it gets, the harder it is to control. People will express their opinions, and especially when they think they have relative anonymity they tend to not remember the golden rule.ON the other hand, for every PIA member that just looks for reasons to be haters, there's 5 members that are helpful, interested in genuine discussion and are there to be part of the community. Things get taken to personally. Of course, when people come in defending (meaning well of course) it's akin to yelling 'Fire' in a crowded room, and genuine discussion disolves into a pissing match. Something to think about.
Joe you expressed an opinion on your forum, which is your right. You actually play and live the dream most of us wish we could. Don't take the jealousy personally. You had as many defenders (if not more..including this Moderator) as you did detractors. When I met you a few years ago, John Mayer was the 'hatee' of the day. At least they're moving several rungs up the musicianship slot.
BTW Thanks again for your time and courtesy when I met you in Sonora right after Sloe Gin came out. Still a highlight for me.
That's me on the far left, with the WCR Pickups Family.http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m141 … Bplus4.jpg
Now for my opinion on the Dumble tone in question. It's okay. Not earth shattering, but D tones don't work for my playing.
A Cathode biased EL34 amp, and a Marshall Jubilee do just fine.Take care,
Mike Petrich
Big Mike
Moderator TGP
The only criticism I have for your amps is that I don't have one.....yet!
You have two JB LP's.....I'd say you have no excuse
Carol-Ann_Amps wrote:Billion81 wrote:Likely not.
That said- how many have you heard? No doubt the Dumbles have there detractors and with good reason. Dumbles and TrainWrecks garner much drama on the forums.
There are around 6 major Dumble variants (circuits) and of those there are myriad different setups-
I happen to love certain circuits that are essentially staged/shared gain circuits based on some key ingredients.
You may not like this (Below) tone- but I think this tone is not what most think or hear in their head when they think Dumble . This is a Clone circuit based on a particular 90s era Dumble , El34 HRM circuit (#183 to be exact) but with a special Marshall Transformer set up. A friend of mine built this for me.
Don't pay attention to the playing but the tone that this thing gets. Pardon the foul language but I was caught off guard at how this thing sounded. This is right out of the box, No loop or effects of any kind. Just a JB Les Paul straight in to the Head with a 2X12 cab with Eminence Delta Pros (Eminence version of EVM12L)
Again- perhaps not your cup of tea which is totally cool- but I thought this was a pretty sick tone and not at all like "typical" dumble tone....if there is such thing.
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_so … ID=9793799
On that note- It's understandable that Joe or anyone else who have a fairly defined D tone to think Peter's amp was a Fugazi. It was at low volume and set for a particularly thin tone so as not to swamp the mic on the recorder so the sound was pretty meek.
The Gear Page dudes can get really cukoo over stuff. I got roasted by a dude who went mental when I suggested that his recommended amp builder might just be human and not capable of "building anything you want".
Cool-
Just for the record the CA JB-100 used for the second solo of 'Stop' is a n EL34 100W amp that has similar gain staging to an HRM Dumble. I would say Joes very very familiar with all Dumble varieties and derivatives.
No doubt Alan- that semi remedial didactic was to a poster on the thread and certainly not to Joe. I know he knows his stuff.
Interesting tid-bit on the 'Stop' CA JB-100 as the fact that he is using a EL34 based CA gets little press as he seems to mostly use the 6l6 variant which I also think is killer. I think the CA amps are brilliant and had a trade for a OD2 for my BlackPlate but the dude took a sale instead.
Still hoping.
I do find it a bit funny that the folks on here were sort of dismissive the D tone yet praise Joe's tone which is heavily flavored by 1/2 his amp rig D type circuits. Clearly the Van Weelden is a straight ODS clone vs. the CA JB100 which has a few D "traits"
It's all the same to me. I don't get twisted up if some loves or hates this or that player or amp or whatever.. You can't take this **## with you folks...
Anyway- My preference would be for a OD2, 100 watt EL34 with a Low Gain set up vs. the Tucana or Revo though Fusionbear's amps are pretty killer with those Scumnicos.
THe Low Gain (Texas version) of the OD-2 with the mid boost option is essentially the same circuit as the JB-100 with the OD channel controls on the outside, except the JB-100 has a higher rated power transformer, world power capability, is top mounted (grrr...I really hate top mounted 100 watters vs bottom mounted...which has become an inside joke with Joe and myself), undergoes a much heavier burn in period (30 hours at full output and played at 2 shows by me using a hotplate to simulate Joes levels). It also has aluminium panels on the back and a slightly different efx loop optimized for the consistently high output levels that Joe runs at.
It was actually an OD-2 EL34 100W that Joe originally tried out and liked.
It must be noted that the gain staging of the 'Texas' OD2 and the JB-100 don't make them optimal for low output playing. The limited edition JB-100's all came with the option of slightly more preamp drive and a more full range to make the amp more pleasurable for players at low volume because the reality is 99% of us cannot play at Joes volumes in the local Irish bar....some guys still opted to have it set up just like Joes however......I cannot stress strong enough that you must use a preamp heavy Marshall style amp as a back drop for this to work correctly as the JB-100 becomes a 'mid-range' amp. Joe uses the Jubilee.
The only JB-100 that Joe owns set up as full range with a bit more preamp gain is his red JB100C combo, which is an EL34 100W running into a single EVM-12L.
dumble shumble, too expensive, and over rated, Robben Ford with a silver face and zendrive sounds just as good! if not better and it's a tenth of the price!
dumble shumble, too expensive, and over rated, Robben Ford with a silver face and zendrive sounds just as good! if not better and it's a tenth of the price!
I have never played one I've bonded with and I've played and worked on at least 10. Each Dumble is different.
In fairness though the instant association of Ford and Dumble is unfortunate. Thats just one player with one tonal preference. If you played his Dumble you would still sound like you and not him.
It's amazing how little people actually know and understand about Dumble amps. The internet has caused this almost obsessive cult following.
I once posted two clips of the same piece on a forum. One played with an EL34 100W OD-2, one played with a 50W 6L6 non-HRM dumble....both through the same speaker cab and both recorded exactly the same with me playing. I then put up a poll and got people to vote on which they thought was the actual Dumble. I said up front what the amps were. 85% of people voting got it wrong. THe owner of the Dumble was there with me so I didn't sway it in the favour of the OD2.
Some of the people that got it 100% wrong were some of the biggest Dumble supporters.
The point isn't that the OD2 is a better amp in any way, it was that people think they know everything about something and have pre-conceived ideas of what to expect and sometimes with a different player it's nothing like what they think.
I don't sound good through a Dumble, period, I hate how they feel, but I'm fine with an OD2, it feels right to me. So....when recorded it shows. To me it's like driving a Ferrari with the seat jammed too far back so I can't reach the pedals....an odd analogy I know......but it's the best way I can put it.
Getting back to Joes original post, I think this is exactly the case here. That player would have been better suited with a different style of amp that worked with him, not against him.
As for over-rated. Everyone will have a different view on that. To me yes.....it's nothing more than $600-$800 worth of off the shelf parts put together by a guy in California. But I can build whatever I feel like. Some people just want to own one. Thats what makes it good, none of us are the same.
Credit where credit is due.....Dumble did pioneer a most excellent 4 gain stage circuit that can be used as a platform to design many different styles of amps. It is far superior to any other similar circuit in it's ability to generate whatever harmonic complexity you desire at a very low noise level. While I don't admire his amps much, I do admire his approach from a technical standpoint. It's hard to explain this without going in to boring technical BS....so I'll save you from that.
Joe Bonamassa Forum → Joe's Guitars, Amps and Gear → Perhaps the best Dumble tone? (my .02)
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